Joel Chan Does Not Even Dare To Dream Of Marrying Florinda Ho Yet

By on August 16, 2011 in Hook-ups & Break-ups, NEWS

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Through an exclusive interview the day before yesterday with Oriental Daily, Macau casino tycoon Stanley Ho’s (何鴻燊) wealthy daughter, Florinda Ho (何超雲) admitted to dating TVB actor Joel Chan (陳山聰). The night after that interview, Florinda brought boyfriend Joel to meet her parents, casino king Stanley and his third wife, Ina Chan (陳婉珍).

Yesterday, Joel accepted an exclusive interview with Oriental Daily and recounted his dining experience with casino king Stanley. As it turned out, Stanley was a TVB drama fan and had seen the television dramas Joel had starred in. Joel professed that he loves Florinda and when asked whether he thought of marrying Florinda, he replied, “We haven’t thought as far as marriage yet!”

R= Reporter; J=Joel

R: “After Florinda publicly disclosed your lover relationship with her, it seems like a lot of people congratulated you thereafter?”

J: “It’s a case of too many people calling me but I didn’t pick up their calls as it was way too tiring.”

R: “Yesterday night was the first time you shared a table and had dinner with casino king Stanley Ho?”

J: “It’s the first time we ate a dinner together. Actually, before this, we have seen each other once.  However that one time was at Mr. Ho’s residence, everyone only said ‘Hi’ and saw each other’s faces. Last night was the first time we dined together hence I was very nervous.”

R: “Did you and Stanley chat with each other?”

J: “Yes, we chatted. He is a very good man.”

R: “Did Stanley ask you to favor Florinda more?”

J: “No, he didn’t mention anything about that. He did ask me about my work though. In the past, he has watched me act as an emperor in Relic of An Emissary <洪武三十二>。

R: “Stanley praised that you acted well?”

J: “(Smiled happily) No, he didn’t say that but he did ask me how old that emperor (that I acted as) actually was.”

R: “What else did you guys talk about?”

J: “Towards the end of the dinner, everyone took a group photo together and Mr. Ho took a rest so I didn’t wish to disturb him.”

Mutual Decision to Publicly Disclose Their Relationship

R: “That was your second time seeing Stanley’s third wife aka Florinda’s mother, Ina Chan?”

J: “Yes.”

R: “There were some hearsay from the press that Ina didn’t like you?”

J: “Those were just rumors! Aunty (Florinda’s mother) did ask me to come along for dinners with them so it can be seen that those rumors were not true.”

R: “Florinda publicly announced your relationship with her, finally a sigh of relief for you?”

J: “Not really a sigh of relief, we are indeed dating. We don’t wish for it to affect too many people. We mutually discussed it with everyone. Her family gave her some opinions and we only disclosed it when everyone was okay with it.”

R: “Outsiders are calling you the future son-in-law of the casino king. What are your thoughts on that?”

J: “It’s not nice to say it that way. We are only dating! One love, one relationship, everyone have been too exaggerated. Dating means dating; I never thought too much about it! As per usual, I am going to earn money and think about work; I will be filming Lee Tim-Shing’s (李添勝) new drama My Cruel Lover <我的如意狼君> soon so I must recollect my feelings and listen to the script later.”

R: “Did you make any promise to Florinda?”

J: “Concentrating fully on my work is the best promise I can give her, putting career as my top priority, as well as treating her well lahs!”

R: “The outside world has been taking both of your status as a comparison, describing it as the woman (Florinda) being more superior than the man (Joel) (女尊男卑), what do you think about this?”

J: “There have been many different voices outside on this. Some congratulated me; some objected to it. We expected that so we won’t care about it. I was single and Florinda was single too.  Both of us already knew earlier that we came from different backgrounds. Since we were able to come together as a couple, we didn’t want to care so much about it.

R: “Have you ever thought of marrying Florinda?”

Joel laughed, “We haven’t thought of marriage yet, just purely wanted to date.”

Casino King Stanley Ho Knew That Joel Was A Divorcee

R: “You have been divorced before. Will your previous divorce become an obstacle to this relationship?”

J: “The matters in the past have blown over. Everyone has a different past of their own and we are taking this time to start a new beginning.”

R: “Did Stanley Ho and his third wife (Florinda’s mother) know you have been divorced in the past?”

J: “Should be, I think they should had known since it was written in the newspapers. Florinda did tell them about it but I didn’t ask too much. I didn’t want to be adversely affected by the matters of the past.”

R: “Do you have faith that this relationship with Florinda will advance further?”

J: “We just started on this relationship, give us some time and space for us to try it out and understand each other better. I am quite confident lahs. I hope to date comfortably and engage in normal couple activities like eating and watching movies together.”

R: “This upcoming September you will start filming another new series. When that day comes, won’t you be too busy working and as a result, neglect your girlfriend Florinda?”

J: “Nope, I won’t. Florinda will adapt and understand that it’s because of work.

R: “Since you guys are dating, are there any rules that both of you adhere to? Like how many phone calls to dial or messages to text each other everyday?”

J: “No, nothing special. We just started taking baby steps into this relationship. We will definitely call or text each other; it’s only natural to do so.”

Confessed That Florinda Was Hard To Woo

R: “When did you first started courting Florinda?”

Joel laughed happily, “What?! Can I not say this? Well, it wasn’t deliberately.”

R: “Was Florinda hard to court?”

J: “Hard, who would say it isn’t hard? If I said it wasn’t hard, then wouldn’t it be very surprising?”

R: “What method did you use to pursue Florinda? By giving her flowers?”

J: “Every girl loves to receive bouquets of flowers lahs! I did some stuffs to make her happy lors!”

R: “Is it easy to make Florinda happy?

J: “Hard! Must guess what she likes! Normally, she will unintentionally reveal one or two things when she speaks and besides that, you have to observe what she likes.”

R: “Then what does Florinda like?”

J: “She likes everything!”

R: “Florinda apparently said that she likes your attentiveness?”

J: “Yes, both of us love fashion.”

R: “So far, what present(s) have you given Florinda?”

J: “I gave her earrings and a necklace.”

Able To Sustain Girlfriend Due To Financial Support From His Family

Being a TVB artist, it was an open secret that Joel Chan’s current income wasn’t a lot. Dating Macau casino King’s daughter, Florinda Ho who has an influential family background, it was inevitable that their background wasn’t on par. This caused the outside world to criticize this relationship as being the woman (Florinda) being more superior to the man (Joel) (女尊男卑) Fortunately Joel had his elder brother (who runs a business in Macau) as his financial backer thus being able to support him and his girlfriend Florinda.

R: “According to Florinda, there was a period of time (during your disappearance) that you returned back to Hong Kong but there was no sign of you in Hong Kong. So where did you go?”

J: “I went to Shanghai and stayed there for close to a month due to some domestic problems back home. It isn’t convenient for me to divulge what happened. Anyway, nearing the end of my stay in Shanghai, I got to know that Florinda was coming back to Hong Kong so I flew to London to accompany her before returning to Hong Kong together.”

R: “You haven’t worked in a long time so there wasn’t any income?”

J: “No, there is no such thing. TVB always gives us a basic pay. [The breakdown of a TVB artist’s income includes basic pay and appearance fees from attending events after deducting commission.] Maybe they might deduct some money if one is on leave but I checked my account before and nothing was deducted. It could also probably be because I had kept many uncleared paid leave.”

R: “Earlier, there were reports that you owed the travel agency about $40,000 HKD for the plane tickets and even went back on your initial promise of paying straightaway after receiving the tickets?”

Joel suddenly became serious, “About that matter, I want to clarify that on that fateful day, I assigned my friend to help me in finding a travel agency to order those airline tickets. I had already given the money intended for the airline tickets to that friend way before this. However, I didn’t expect that friend went back on his promise (in handing my money over to the travel agency). I would not overturn my promise just because of a few thousand dollars! Even though I have already explained, I doubt anyone will believe me so I’m leaving it for my manager to handle. I do not know this travel agency involved but they didn’t check what happened properly and accused me of something I didn’t do. I think that’s highly unprofessional of them.”

R: “Why wasn’t the money paid to the travel agency as promised earlier?”

J: “That friend of mine who was holding onto the money, fell sick and had to be hospitalized.”

R: “Were you unhappy that they said you went back on your earlier promise?”

Joel said in an agitated tone, “Yes, I was indeed unhappy because I wasn’t the one who called them to order the plane tickets. They (travel agency) wrongly accused me through the media without checking matters properly, it was as good as posting recruitment ads on the walls and telling the whole world. They didn’t even bother to notify me when it isn’t hard to find me/ I think that they have some operational problems in their professionalism and in maintaining their clients’ confidentiality.

R: “How’s your usual financial condition coming along?”

J: “It’s normal; enough for me to spend on my daily life. My brother’s company in Macau would give me some money too.

R: “Taking care of a girlfriend isn’t a problem too?”

J: “I only buy small presents. Florinda also didn’t ask me to buy diamonds for her.

R: “How much money are you planning to earn or save before getting married?”

J: “I never gave that a thought. Florinda and I feel that it shouldn’t be measured through monetary means. If we really cared about money, then we wouldn’t have been able to get together. Both of us have a consensus. Dating means purely dating and not because of money matters. Many people said that I’m greedy but as long as my family and I know that isn’t true, nothing else matters. If any problem happens to appear in our relationship in the future, it definitely will not be attributed to money problems.”


Source: Orientaldaily.on.cc

This article was translated by Ah K, a Contributing Writer at JayneStars.com.

264 comments to Joel Chan Does Not Even Dare To Dream Of Marrying Florinda Ho Yet

  1. Jayne says:

    So Joel admits to using his brother’s money to sustain his living habits. So he’s a 30 something man with a job (albeit not a high paying salary), expensive taste in designer clothes and women, still using his family money…. Anything wrong with this picture?

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    • Kidd replied:

      Maybe he has a share in the company, so, gets monthly dividend.

      Just a guess.

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      • Jayne replied:

        Kidd,
        “Maybe he has a share in the company, so, gets monthly dividend”

        If that is the case, it sounds more appropriate than simply stretching out hands to ask for monthly check. The tabloids made it sound as if Joel simply turns to his family for money, which lacks a bit dignity.

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      • Ah K replied:

        @Kidd @Jayne:

        I think it’s possible that Joel had a stake in his elder brother’s business in Macau too cause I read somewhere before that this business was handled by Joel’s father and elder brother while Joel pursued a career in showbiz so I guess it does kind of make it a family business?

        Plus as the newspaper article stated, “My brother’s company in Macau would give me some money too.” if it was his brother who gave him money then he could jolly well said my brother would give me some money too but Joel didn’t and said that his brother’s company would give him money too so I guess he might have owned some percentage of shares in that company? Or is his brother that nice to order his company to transfer some money to Joel as and whenever he needs it?

        Whatever it is, I think from the moment Joel chose to step out of the family business and into the entertainment industry, he should have learnt to be independent and earn and spend his own keep, it isn’t wise to keep relying on his family members to support his lavish lifestyle. If his brother remains single for the rest of his life, it is still fine but if his brother gets married and has a child, won’t his wife be worried about how Joel keeps leeching onto him for money? I think humans are selfish creatures, more so if you are non-blood related, so I think that if I’m Joel’s brother’s wife, I would worry that Joel would squander away the family fortune one day and leave nothing for my son. Plus won’t Joel feel embarassed about asking for money from his nephew (his brother’s son) all the time, in time to come?

        If he successfully marries Florinda, of course that is one thing. But if he doesn’t and they break up, then it is another thing altogether.

        And I agree with @Jayne and secretly wonder, a relationship based on novelty and a lavish lifestyle, will it last? Or will it last until Joel’s brother finally feels that enough is enough and cuts off Joel’s money supply? Well, as much as someone loves you, they will eventually get tired one day.

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      • LeilaFan replied:

        I do not personally know a lot of women who did not have to work or didn’t want to work after they graduate from school. ——— THANK YOU very much Jayne. This is what I want to point out. We all experience and see different things in our life. All my friends and co-workers go to work and they are mothers, so in my view, I will say that most people who have a good well paid job would still want go to work.
        As for others, if they live and see their friends stay home mother, then in their view, women love to stay home mom.
        This is all come down to personal viewpoints and what we see from our surrounding.
        I just find it to be ridiculous how my statement can be an “insult” to stay home women, when all I write are just my viewpoints only.
        I don’t want to keep debate about this, since Jayne already step in. I want to keep this a peaceful environment to Jaynestars and this website as a happy home for all of us.

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    • HeTieShou replied:

      Well, they are family and Joel works too so it’s not like he doesn’t. He may have a share in the company too so I don’t think it is just like he is just asking for spending money. If that is the case, then how it is it with housewives who don’t work and always ask their husbands for money??

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      • josie replied:

        Joel said it’s his “brother’s company” so I don’t think he does any work there. Maybe he has a share of the company thru inheritance but he doesn’t actually contribute anything to earn that spending money.

        The job of a housewife is housework- cook, clean, take care of the kids, etc… That is a lot of hard work so they deserve to spend their husband’s money.
        If u think housewives watch soaps or play mahjong all day, ask your mom if running a household takes any work. Mom will set u straight!

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      • Veejay replied:

        @HTS,

        You will be surprised that housewives are generally more exhausted working than those working people! Housewives have to sweep floors, cook, buy groceries, clean, do dirty laundry, etc and they can really work from 9am till 6pm or maybe more!

        Some wives also need to wash the dishes for their family after dinner (for families living in Asia, not included usa and etc since they have dish washer which save alot of works!).

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      • Kidd replied:

        @ Veejay

        You should say this to Leilafan. It’s Leilafan who strongly disapproves of wife staying at home asking husband for money.

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      • Veejay replied:

        Ahhhhh I tot it was HTs lol, Thanks Kidd.

        hey HTS,
        Sorry ya, I thought it was you who strongly disapproved wives asking hubbies money for staying home xD.. as I didnt read the above posts.

        @Leilafan,

        Why are you disapproving? just curious.

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      • LeilaFan replied:

        @Veejay, because I believe that anyone have a college degree, who are capable of bring home a month $4,000 – $5,000 USD should go to work instead of stay at home.
        I went to college 4 years Veejay, I didn’t go to college so I can be a home mom. I went to college so I have a career. If I can bring home $4,000 USD a month, why do I need to give that up to stay home?
        Veejay, if my husband was rich, then me stay home is OK. But my husband is not rich, if I do not work to help him pays the bills, who will help pay the bills?
        I refuse to stay at home, I been working since I was 18 year olds, I’m use to it.

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      • Kidd replied:

        @ Leilafan

        “Veejay, if my husband was rich, then me stay home is OK. “

        I remember your voice of disapproval was stronger than that. Whenever there’s news of actresses marrying rich or people profess to want to marry some earning higher than them you disapproved and then went on to make belittling remark about housewife, saying they just ask hubby for money when they can work.

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      • Kidd replied:

        @ Leilafan

        “Veejay, if my husband was rich, then me stay home is OK. “

        It’s not OK for you even if your husband was rich, because I remember you saying that women should be financially independent so that if husband get mistress or leave, you can still survive.

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      • LeilaFan replied:

        @Kidd, I was giving an example in he post above. Maybe I word that wrong, let me reword it. (If anyone married a rich husband, they stay home is OK, because their husband is rich.)
        And as for me, this (IF) will NEVER COME, because 1) I refuse to married anyone rich, I only married poor or middle class. 2) I have a college degree, if I can bring home $40,000 USD a year, I no need rich men. 3) Yes, you right!! I will repeat. I WILL NEVER STAY HOME!!! PERIOD!!! Because I do not like the feelings living use anyone money especially I have a “career” and ofcurse like I say before, I work to keep my money in the Bank, so if my husband one day walk out on me, I still can use my money in my Bank to feed my own a-s-s.
        And what I write above is MY LIFE. My life, I have every rights to choose how I want to live my life. Remember, you cannot control other people actions, but you can control your own, and I choose to live this way.
        I do not interfere with other people living style. I state my opinions and viewpoints on this issue.

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      • Kidd replied:

        @ Leilafan

        I have never plan to control or dictate your life. You live your life whatever way you want. But, the impression I get from all your comments regarding stay at home mom is you disapproves of them, not just an isolated case of talking about your own life.

        Maybe I get you wrong, but, I’m not the only one who get this impression that you look down on housewives.

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      • LeilaFan replied:

        @Kidd, no you right. I disaprove them. Because I believe women should be financial independent. I disaprove, I disagree, is one thing, people do it or not is their choice.
        And believe me Kidd, no women want to stay home if they have a career and a good job. Trust me on this OK.
        Those who stay home are those married rich old men or those who are just do not have jobs, or jobs that make way less than their husband.
        Believe me, no women want to stay home if she is capable of working and bring money home.

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      • Funn Lim replied:

        Believe me a lot of women will rather stay at home and be a full time mom if they married financially capable husbands or other women. I would love never having to work for a living but rather work for interest, attend charity events and basically have free time. No women want to juggle it all, it is awful and difficult. And even if the woman isn’t working and dependent on her husband, so what? He brings home the dough, she takes care of the family. Someone has to be at home to nurture the children and someone has to go out and earn a living to feed everyone. It may be a necessity or a lifestyle choice, whatever it may be I won’t condemn those. I will condemn those women who marry 1 year, divorce and expects to be taken care of for life.

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      • Funn Lim replied:

        Leilafan you have just insulted a lot of housewives

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      • Kidd replied:

        ” I will condemn those women who marry 1 year, divorce and expects to be taken care of for life.”

        Now, this type of women, I strongly disapproves of.

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      • LeilaFan replied:

        @Funn, quote me which sentence I write that insult housewife?
        Just because I disagree with you that make me insult housewife?
        No women want to stay home if they have a career and a good job. Trust me on this OK. — I write this quote, and this is what I think. And that insult housewife to you?
        So anyone disagree with you means they insult housewife, Oh well, in life not everything will goes your ways, and nobody have to talk a certain way to make you happy Funn. Live with it.
        And if you think anywhere in my post I write is insult housewife, feel free to cut and paste it here and show me.

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      • Funn Lim replied:

        Which sentence? Does Jayne has a word limit?

        “no women want to stay home if they have a career and a good job” = housewives do not have a career or good job = useless?

        “Those who stay home are those married rich old men or those who are just do not have jobs, or jobs that make way less than their husband” = housewives are either gold diggers who marry rich old men or jobless or incapable of finding a good job therefore useless?

        “no women want to stay home if she is capable of working and bring money home” = housewives are incapable of bringing home money because they are incapable of finding a job because they’re useless?

        “If anyone married a rich husband, they stay home is OK, because their husband is rich” – I probably agree with you on this but the reasoning is housewives married rich leach on their rich husbands and they themselves are just parasites? and they could be since husband is rich and by same reasoning of your previous arguments, the rich husband is old?

        “Because I do not like the feelings living use anyone money especially I have a “career”” – which is your personal opinion which I don’t disagree but in light of everything you’ve posted, meaning housewives are parasites.

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      • LeilaFan replied:

        @Funn, what you write are your own interpretion. Your own interpretion is not solid proof saying I insult housewife.
        Let me repaste what I write OK:

        “no women want to stay home if they have a career and a good job” —- I write this, and I stand by my viewpoints of this. If you think that is insult housewife, then you can post this around every single internet Forum and see if they agree with you that is an “insult”

        “Those who stay home are those married rich old men or those who are just do not have jobs, or jobs that make way less than their husband” —— I wrote this, and I stand by what I write. Don’t put your intepretion into it and call it an “insult”

        “no women want to stay home if she is capable of working and bring money home” ——- I wrote this, and I again stand by this. If you think this is an insult, post it around housewife forum, see if they call that an insult.

        You just uncomfortable because I do not see the same view as you. And I’m sorry if I offended your “housewife dream” but I do not find that to be any insult.

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      • LeilaFan replied:

        None in my post I write the word “parasite” or “useless”
        It just you think that. Maybe you get offended because you want to be a housewife and I don’t.
        Too bad, I will NOT talk a certain way to make you happy. If you think that is an insult, that is your problem. Repost what I write to the whole world, see if any Americans or Asian find what I write is an insult.

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      • LeilaFan replied:

        @Funn, nobody call housewife are “parasite” or “useless”
        Quote me where in my post I call housewife those name? You just interprete it your own way and insult your ownself calling yourself “parasite” and “useless” since you write those words in your post, NOT ME.

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      • Funn Lim replied:

        Leilafan, I can confirm at least THREE single girls are insulted by what you wrote and is exasperated by the fact that you see nothing terrible. I myself have called people names and gold diggers and such but to be so consistent in your every post, it is indeed your deeply held beliefs which I can’t say I agree with nor respect. You probably may not mean what I interpret but my guess is, you do. Is it that terrible to be a housewife? Is it that weak for a woman to leave her high flying career and devote her time to her husband, her family, her marriage and her children even if the husband makes barely enough? Same as if the husband is the househusband, is it worthy of condemn? You have said many times you worked your way up, you earn a comfortable living, you choose to work, your husband chooses to work or is maybe less capable than you hence you have to work to pay the bills when he can’t afford it. Some women may have chosen to marry a more capable man perhaps, more ambitious man but of course they suffer; the more ambitious, the less at home, the less participative. It is through your eyes that I begin to have newfound respect for housewives. I have never thought much of them, I see whatever they do as either a choice or a necessity, they’re neither lazy nor unsuccessful, they’re what they’re. But after reading your extreme views, I begin to see housewives can be a job, a career and a career that does not have a 9 to 5 time limit, a career where she can’t say no to the “boss” and not have bearings on her marriage, where the only way to say I quit is to divorce. Housewives is a full time occupation and for whatever reason women stay at home, for wbatever reason they choose to stop working and devote their time to whatever it may be, I have learnt to never condemn them and generalise them until I understand why. Some for lazy reasons, some are parasites, some for noble reasons, some for practical reasons. Housewives do not mean they were a failure career wise, some were highly successful. By your definition, Michelle Obama a housewife was a failure at her job? But I thank you for opening my eyes. I see rather clearly now.

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      • LeilaFan replied:

        LeilaFan quote: No women want to stay home if they have a career and a good job.

        Funn quote: Believe me a lot of women will rather stay at home and be a full time mom if they married financially capable husbands.

        OK clearly there 2 different opinions here. Who agree with who that is up to each person views. My quote is not an insult, if you think I insult housewife, awww too bad for you.

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      • Funn Lim replied:

        Leilafan, I did not insult myself, but you insult women in general. You may not say those clearly, but you might as well have said it. You take 5 sentences to make a point where 2 words would have been your intention. I save you your time.

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      • LeilaFan replied:

        Again, I will repost my quote. NO WOMEN WOULD WANT TO STAY HOME IF SHE CAPABLE OF HAVING A WELL PAY JOB AND A CAREER.
        You find that offensive and insult, tough luck for you. That is what I think, and I don’t change the way I think for anyone.

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      • Funn Lim replied:

        Anyone with better English command than I do may be able to settle this once and for all.

        The sentence;

        “NO WOMEN WOULD WANT TO STAY HOME IF SHE CAPABLE OF HAVING A WELL PAY JOB AND A CAREER.”

        So am I right to say “A woman stays at home because she is incapable of having a well paid job and a career”

        Tell me, women who stay at home, there must be some here, are you not offended by this sentence in the slightest? I mean doesn’t it mean you’re at home because you can’t earn enough and you don’t have a career to begin with, doesn’t that mean you’re useless?

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      • lol replied:

        @Leilafan – “no women want to stay home if she is capable of working and bring money home”

        you are generalizing. If the husband don’t make enough yes this is true but if the husband salary is more than enough it’s not necessary. Plus some woman’s mentality changed after being a mum. It’s called motherly love. Being a housewife and take care of kids personally isn’t a bad thing when the husband already can provide for the family

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      • LeilaFan replied:

        Did you ever ask yourself why Michelle Obama is a stay home wife? Her husband is the president, he make enough money for her to stay home. Do you ever ask yourself the question if her husband was poor, do you think she can stay home? Simply answer is No.
        This goes back one of my quote, she married a rich man (even before Obama was president, he was a lawyer)
        Don’t ever think if you want to be a housewife, you can be a housewife. You stay home or not is also up to your husband too. If your husband feel you need to work to helps pay the bills, he will not let you stay home and not bring in any income.
        Men let their wife stay home are men that make enough and bring home enough money, that is why their wife no need to work.
        I did not insult any housewife, only you feel offended and think I insult housewife.

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      • LeilaFan replied:

        Read my whole post lol! You right, if you married rich men who can provide you everything, then stay home.
        But who can married rich men so wealth off that they don’t have to go to work?
        Again, back to the quote I said: No women want to stay him if she have a well paid job and a career. AND women stay home are women who married rich men (who make enough to sponser their life), have no jobs (no job or not employ, then they stay home) or make much less than their husband (if husband make much more, and wife not bring home that much, then she might as well stay home)
        I will not apoligize s-h-i-t for what I said, too bad if you find what I write is an “insult”

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      • LeilaFan replied:

        @Funn, Haha!! If every women like you likes to stay home then this world will run out of women doctors and women lawyers.
        Go ask a woman who is a doctor to stay home OK Funn! You tell me how many lawyers and doctors that are women willing to give up their job and stay home? Not much.
        So back to my quote, Women with a career and well paid job, they most likely will refuse to be a stay home wife.

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      • Funn Lim replied:

        “he make enough money for her to stay home”

        Sorry to burst your bubble, but michelle obama was making way more than your president before he became a president and if she continued to work, she would have made more than he does now. She had to stay at home, because she is the first lady, she is the hostess to the many guests. She made a sacrifice career wise for her husband.

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      • Funn Lim replied:

        “Go ask a woman who is a doctor to stay home OK Funn! You tell me how many lawyers and doctors that are women willing to give up their job and stay home? Not much.’

        This quote itself you would have insulted me if I was married but since I am not, it does not apply to me, yet.

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      • LeilaFan replied:

        LeilaFan said: most women will not stay home if she make alot of mney and have a career and a good job.

        Funn said: most women would love to stay home if their husband make enough to support the family.

        And example of Michelle Obama is ONE example.
        My example said if all women love to stay home, then the whole world will have no female doctors, or female lawyers.
        Therefore back to my quote, I am still right. MOST WOMEN WILL NOT STAY HOME IF SHE HAVE A CAREER AND A WELL PAY JOB!!!

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      • anya replied:

        @leilafan: I didn’t want to jump in, but suddenly I want to answer your questions about: women capable of earning good want to stay home? Yes I do. I own my business. Whenever I look at my baby girl, I never feel I have enough time for her, even though she stay with me most of the time at work. She has her own room there, video games, movies, tons of books…. Tell you she has most everything little girls want. However, I always feel bad that I can not take a walk with her as much as I want, I can’t learn how to bake a good cake, pies like her grandma does which she always ask me” mom, can you make a cake for me?” or” I wish you know how to make beautiful cakes like grandma” this is what make me want to stay home, devote my time to my girl, being a good mom that she can be proud of. How much money I earn she doesn’t care, how good degree I have she doesn’t care, what she want is her mom take a walk with her, bake her favorite cake, pick flowers with her, make a home a sweet home.

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      • LeilaFan replied:

        @anya, then why you not stay home? because you need the money to pay bills and to take care of your family.
        So back to my quote “Unless you married a rich husband so he can support you” then you staying home is not much of a choice.
        And for the rest, I do not see anything I wrote is an insult, nor I will not apoligize to anyone about what I wrote. It is what I feel and I stand up for it.

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      • LeilaFan replied:

        @anya, then why you not give up your business job and stay home then? Nobody is forcing you go to work, stop and be a stay home mom? Even yourself are still working and not a stay home mom.
        So I stand by my quote, NOBODY WOULD WANT TO BE A STAY HOME MOM IF THEY HAVE A GOOD PAID JOB AND A CAREER. Maybe I should add, most women will not give up their good pay job to stay at home. If all women can do that then the whole world will have no women working.
        Saying you want to be a stay home mom is one thing, ACTUALLY doing it is another thing. I can guarantee almost all poor and middle class incomes have no choice but to get their a-s-s to work, unless they married wealthy men.

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      • anya replied:

        Because I’m divorced, I have to raise my daughter by myself. You think just say quit then quit that easy. Yes, I agree with Funn that sometimes I feel you leilafan not living in reality world 🙂

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      • LeilaFan replied:

        So all women all love to stay home and be a stay home mom then there be no actress for you to watch, since all actress want to stay home. How about let tell Cecilia to stay home and take care of her 2 sons and stop go filming.
        If you claim to live in a reality world then you should know well that people with a well pay job and good career will not likely give it up to stay home (I can say most will not give up)
        Making money, the more and more you make, it will attract you to working and will not give it up.

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      • anya replied:

        My opinion: most women want to stay home, they just have no choice because they married poor men like you, leilafan, or divorced women like me 🙂 so bravo to smart women who can married good rich guys, who can provide them good life, so they can stay home and devote their time for their loved ones

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      • LeilaFan replied:

        Haha!! Cecilia Cheung is not poor, she can be a stay home mom and take care of her 2 sons, Nic obviously make enough. Why she not a stay home mom but keep taking movies deal and go filming?
        I disagree with you. Like the reasons I say above, women make alot of money not likely want to stay home, money is attractive in the realistic world like you say.

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      • anya replied:

        Yes, leilafan, I understand what you mean that if everyone want to stay home then no actress for us to watch….. That’s why every one has diffrerent thinking, but if you ask earning good money want to stay home? Then I say yes, I do. However, that’s just my guilty feelings, but I need work to provide my daughter a good life, and not only for my little family, I need money so I can help my relatives too, whoever came to Us for study, I will help them have a good places to stay, good meals to eat, not as bad, and poor as I was when I just first came here. So money is very important, I have money, I can provied me good life and help others. So work is still my only choice

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      • anya replied:

        Talking about Cecil, don’t you think because she loves fame, and work that why she doesn’t have happy family? Talking about yoyo( you may know I’m fan of Yoyo so I can talk about her for sure) eventhough she not married to Ekin yet(or maybe shedid we never know) she is capable of earning good money, there was a year she earned 6 millions, but she chose to be semi retired to have more time for Ekin, learn to cook, to travel, accompany him anywhere. So there, another examples of women willing to earn less or not for their loved ones

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      • LeilaFan replied:

        @anya, that still go back to what I said. Yoyo might be semi-retire because she herself already make enough money in the past, and Ekin also make enough money.
        Do you honestly think a poor or average income family would just stop working and be a stay home mom? Simply answer is No!
        Just like you say, you work so you have a good life with your money.
        I work because I like my job and my degree, and it make me happy when I recieve my paycheck. So you ask me, would I stop working, answer is No!
        Want to stay home is one thing, but have the capabily of stay home is another thing. It is also up to your husband, how much money you have in the Bank, and if your own willing to want to stop working.
        You say you want to stay home anya, but you DID NOT stay home, so you are not counted as in the example of women stay home.

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      • anya replied:

        If we keep talk and talk it will never ending, I just want answer your questions that yes, women earning good want to stay home too, if ask all my friends I believe they want to, just that the reality life not let us do so.

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      • LeilaFan replied:

        OK, if that is what you think then that is what you think.
        I still said,
        WOMEN WITH GOOD PAY JOB AND A GOOD CAREER WOULD NOT WANT TO STAY HOME.
        And that is my quote, anyone feel that is an insult or offended, too bad. Learn to live with it, I do not and will not talk a certain way just to make you happy, go tell your husband or children do that for you.

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      • Kidd replied:

        “So back to my quote, Women with a career and well paid job, they most likely will refuse to be a stay home wife.”

        This is untrue. I know a woman who has a good career and earn a lot. But, after some consideration, she chose to quit her job and be a full time mom to her children.

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      • LeilaFan replied:

        Untrue? Let get the world statistic then.
        You think is untrue because you know the women around you quit job to stay home.
        I think it true because the women around me would rather go work and bring home the money instead of stay home.
        If all women stay home like you, there will be no women working in this world left.
        I am willing to debate this endlessly with anyone. I will stand by my quote, MOST WOMEN WHO GET PAY ALOT WOULD PREFER WORKING INSTEAD OF STAY HOME!

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      • LeilaFan replied:

        I know a woman who has a good career and earn a lot. But, after some consideration, she chose to quit her job and be a full time mom to her children. ———– I know a woman who have her own business store with 3 kids, and she is working because she enjoy having all those $100USD in her purse everyday that she make from her business. She, herself refuse to stay home, she hired a nanny to take care her 3 children instead.

        So is your words and my words. A woman you know, and woman I know. We all see different things in our life.

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      • Funn Lim replied:

        “And example of Michelle Obama is ONE example.”

        How many american presidents? I shall reference ALL of their wives as examples.

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      • LeilaFan replied:

        How many american presidents? I shall reference ALL of their wives as examples. ———— Hhahaha!!!!
        1) Not all the president wife make more money than their husband.
        2) Not all the president wife have a better career than their husband.
        3) They stay home because their husband are president and making money enough for them to stay home. Do you think they will stay home if their husband is NOT president?

        Again, I say the same thing. WOMEN WOULD NOT PREFER STAY HOME IF THEY MAKE ALOT OF MONEY AND HAVE GOOD CAREERS!!

        Let’s keep debate this then. You can give your examples, I can give mine.

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      • jayne replied:

        @Anya @LeilaFan @Funn
        “I just want answer your questions that yes, women earning good want to stay home too, if ask all my friends I believe they want to, just that the reality life not let us do so.”

        Agree that practicality comes first in guiding our decisions. Not only along terms of how much it costs to have basic necessities to pay for housing and kids, but also what kind of lifestyle the couple wants to have materially. It may take two full-time salaries to sustain a certain lifestyle. More married women with kids can probably afford to not work than they believe, however that means cutting back on spending and doing less with more. Certain material possessions such as buying a house, driving a certain car, and other big ticket items make it difficult to sustain on one person’s salary alone.

        Also, there are considerations regarding the couple’s financial future and the kids’ impending expenses such as college education. Can the couple afford to live a certain desired lifestyle and achieve their future financial goals based on one income (for a short time or extended time) or do they need dual income?

        There are also different values and principles guiding the decision to work or not work. Some mothers with young children do want to spend more time at home and not miss those moments when their children are young. It is the greater loyalty to family that drives that desire to not work, not because they are lazy. Becoming a mother changes one’s values. Staying at home and forfeiting career and money may be just greater priority placed in involved role in parenting.

        Maintaining a job and career offers financial and mental independence and allows them to retain and strengthen a self-identity outside the family. Perhaps some women prefer to have a more individualistic identity outside of the family. Perhaps they identify themselves more with their career and that self-identity tied to work means more to them. Maybe they want to be less involved with child rearing and prefer to have a job outside of home, to be with peers, and stay in touch with working society and broaden everyday contact outside of family. Maybe they find work rewarding, both in job responsibilities, and more intellectually stimulating than child care. After becoming a mother, some women’s sense of self-identity as a mother becomes much stronger than other aspects of themselves, while others may see motherhood as an additional role, but not necessarily all-consuming. Some women may gravitate towards motherhood, want to spend more time with kids, even choosing to leave the work force. While other women want to have a self-identity outside of home. Staying in the work force allows them to strengthen those other aspects of self-identity, financial independence from spouse, and time away from family.

        Sometimes you don’t miss work until you have not worked for a lengthy period, such as a few years. When I furthered my education several years ago, I took a hiatus from working. School and work are very different environments and I did miss certain elements of working in an office and learning from colleagues, who vary in age and life experience, more than a typically similar age group in a student body.

        Whether a woman has a good career or not, it really depends on her and her spouse’s values to determine whether she should stay home and abandon her career (perhaps not forever, but at least for a foreseeable number of years). Even if she wants to work, but husband may want her to be more involved with kids to bring them up. Maybe she doesn’t want to work, but husband wants her to due to the advantages and financial security of a dual income and more freedom to live more materially comfortable lifestyle.

        It’s a difficult decision that many households, especially married couples with young kids, have to consider. The quality of child care for young kids if the mother stays at home versus her working? Obviously income level affects the family’s lifestyle. Finally, it depends on the woman to make this personal decision and determine whether she would be happy and willing to put her career on hiatus in exchange for more time with her children and at home.

        It is too easy to jump on the bandwagon and say that married women who don’t work are parasites living off their husbands. Unless practically speaking, the husband alone can never pay household bills and the couple are unwilling or unable to cut down on their expenses, and the wife is still unwilling to work. Otherwise, the choice to work or not to will be governed by the household’s economics and values.

        My evaluation is based on married women with young kids, as becoming a mother may make many women question whether they should leave the work force to spend more time at home. I do not personally know a lot of women who did not have to work or didn’t want to work after they graduate from school. Financially, they would either need their parents, boyfriend, or spouse to support them.

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      • Funn Lim replied:

        Leilafan I have given examples, and you have given nothing but capital letters.

        Jayne, the problem is she can’t differentiate between a necessity and a choice. She just lumps everything into one.

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      • LeilaFan replied:

        I do not personally know a lot of women who did not have to work or didn’t want to work after they graduate from school. ——— THANK YOU very much Jayne. This is what I want to point out. We all experience and see different things in our life. All my friends and co-workers go to work and they are mothers, so in my view, I will say that most people who have a good well paid job would still want go to work.
        As for others, if they live and see their friends stay home mother, then in their view, women love to stay home mom.
        This is all come down to personal viewpoints and what we see from our surrounding.
        I just find it to be ridiculous how my statement can be an “insult” to stay home women, when all I write are just my viewpoints only.
        I don’t want to keep debate about this, since Jayne already step in. I want to keep this a peaceful environment to Jaynestars and this website as a happy home for all of us.

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      • jayne replied:

        LeilaFan,
        “NO WOMEN WOULD WANT TO STAY HOME IF SHE CAPABLE OF HAVING A WELL PAY JOB AND A CAREER”

        I think this statement implies that if a woman has a good career, she will not want to be a housewife. This is a statement made more from a practical standpoint, that if the woman’s career is well-paid and has a bright future, there is a lot to lose financially if she stays a home. However, the statement can also make people think of the opposite extreme: does that mean housewives only chose to be housewives because they have a low-paid and poor career? Not necessarily so. I know of a few friends, well paid health professionals, who stayed home after having children. They were in good professions, but they chose family over career.

        Choosing family over career is not a selfish choice. In fact, it takes a lot of self-sacrifice for a woman to be willing to walk away from her career (even a few years hiatus will inevitably set back her future career advancement). Choosing family over career is a personal choice.

        “Unless you married a rich husband so he can support you”
        Obviously, our life choices are restricted by reality. If we are not from ultra-rich backgrounds, we do not know whether our values and choices may be a large departure from where they stand now. First comes the practical matter of whether we all need to work to pay our bills. Then comes the choice of whether we want to or not. Having the rich husband may change your values more than you know. Until we live that life, it would be impossible to be so certain about our current values.

        “I do not personally know a lot of women who did not have to work or didn’t want to work after they graduate from school”

        I want to amend my statement and say that most women I know went to school because they wanted to pursue a certain career track in the future. That’s why we all go to college, so we can find a job to fulfill our intellectual and financial dreams. Few students do not work immediately following graduation based on self-choice. However, having kids changes your circumstances and values, involving money, career, and family.

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      • LeilaFan replied:

        @Funn, sorry to dissapoint you but I will not say anything the way you want just for you to be happy and satisfy your ego.
        Maybe your husband and your future children can do that, not me.

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      • Kidd replied:

        @ Leilafan

        You know what is the problem with your statements? You made a simple statement.

        “NO WOMEN WOULD WANT TO STAY HOME IF SHE CAPABLE OF HAVING A WELL PAY JOB AND A CAREER.”

        So, Funn give you example of women who chose to stay home. Anya told you she would want to stay home.

        But, you go and argument with the following statement

        “then why you not stay home? because you need the money to pay bills and to take care of your family.”

        “Unless you married a rich husband so he can support you” then you staying home is not much of a choice”

        These 2 sentences are in totally different context from you original statement.

        You original statement is women who earn good money and have good career will not want to stay at home. It’s a choice irregardless of husband rich or not.

        But, all your argument toward Anya and Funn is about women without such choice.

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      • LeilaFan replied:

        I make my point clear enough that “women who make alot of money and have a good career would not prefer stay home”
        If you claim all women want to stay home, then I suggest you go to Yale or Harvard and do a survey OK. Ask all the WOMEN who are in Yale or Harvard, who are going to be future doctors and lawyers, see if they answer you that they will stay home after they graduated with a good career.
        And I still believe that even those doctors and lawyers graduated married men, I still believe they PREFER to go to work because of their career passion.

        As for women that married rich men, they can stay home, because their husband make way more than them. Just like I said, I do not stay home because no way I have enough money to pay for house payments and bills and my family spending with just my husband’s income.

        You just think all women loves to stay home because you see your friends stay home.

        I think women would prefer go to work because my co-workers are all married and works, so are all my college friends.

        So conclusion, what we think are based on what we see in our life and what we experience. I did not insult any women from my post, and I will not apoligize to nobody for what I said.

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      • anya replied:

        @[email protected]:
        You see women go to work not mean they “want” to work. Have you ever ask them if they married a well- earned husband, would they stay home make a beautiful home, cook delicious food when he come home, go travel when he has time? I believe most of women wants that, they are secretly envious of those women living that kind of life, they just not tell you. Women tend to talk opposite what they think. Like most women say I don’t love dimonds, but if their men give them diamonds they will jump up and down with joy, and may have a sleepless night because they keep staring at the diamonds 🙂 but it not means they love diamonds what they happy about is the men’s thoughts intentions of making them happy. So if the husband is a good man, earn good and telling his please stay home, I would like to take care of you but if you want to have a career that would be fine too” I believe the women would be happy to be stay home mom, or working part time only. However, reality is that not many men now a day can provide such a good life like they want so of course they will not asking their wife to stay home

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      • jayne replied:

        Anya,
        “You see women go to work not mean they “want” to work. Have you ever ask them if they married a well- earned husband, would they stay home make a beautiful home, cook delicious food when he come home, go travel when he has time?”

        Working or not, a person’s mind needs to be positively occupied to be happy. I took a 2 year hiatus from work to go back to school and towards the end of that period, I was eager to go back to work. I missed the dynamics of the work place and to be honest, I had too much idle time as a student. Although staying in a certain job for a long time may make one restless and unhappy, I think the particular work conditions may make the person want to stay at home from time to time. Having a little break between jobs is a good thing. But permanently not working involves a drastic change to lifestyle which may not be suitable for everyone and make them happy. Personally, just as one may get restless in a particular job, I think you can also get restless from not working.

        Work is part of one’s self-identity. Even if we have a rich husband and don’t need to work, perhaps doing some part-time work would be a better balance. Personally, I don’t like to stay at home too much and prefer to be more occupied with people around me.

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      • Funn Lim replied:

        Leilafan, I think Jayne was saying something against your line of thought. Anyway if you wish to stop, please do so, as they say, ignorance is bliss. I am not asking you to change your line of thought, you’re entitled to your opinion, I do not wish to waste my time asking you to change and I applaud your consistency however misguided or however confused now you sound. However I was just merely, as I was replying again and again trying to point out to you that you are quite simply wrong. I do not even want to satisfy my ego. I am not married, I am working single girl taking care of myself, so I shouldn’t be offended until I am. You’re just insulting your married friends who chose to stay at home. It is your ego that you’re trying to protect. Again I am merely trying to point out you are very very wrong. Whether you agree or not is up to you but I lost count how many has now openly disagree with you. If you want statistics, there you have it.

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      • Kidd replied:

        “I think it true because the women around me would rather go work and bring home the money instead of stay home.
        If all women stay home like you, there will be no women working in this world left.”

        First, I work. So, your statement ‘If all women stay home like you’.

        Secondly, what’s with this ‘if all’ argument? Anyone say all women want to stay home? Why is it have to be all or none to you?

        You said

        “No women would want to stay home if she is capable of having a well pay job and career”

        It’s an absolute statement. But, when Funn, Anya, me show you examples of women who want to stay home despite having a well pay job and career, you go

        1) Not everyone can marry rich husband and women have not choice but to work.
        2) If all women stay at home, there will be no actress, women doctors..

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      • LeilaFan replied:

        @anya, that is what you think, but not what everybody think.
        Go to Yale and Harvard and ask all the future doctors and lawyers see if they want to stay home even if they married rich men.
        There are people who have passion for their career you know. Women doctors don’t just give up their doctors job and be stay home mom. There also women who love fame and money too you know, and will not give those up just to be stay home mom. Examples many actress still work as much as they can and make as much money, until they get around agfe 35-40 and then start to want to settle down, by that time they already make enough money.

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      • LeilaFan replied:

        @Kidd, I will not apoligize or take back anything I said.
        I will write again, ALL OR MOST WOMEN WOULD PREFER GO TO WORK IF THEY HAVE A JOB THAT PAY WELL OR A GOOD CAREER.
        You want to continue this debate, let’s continue.
        I don’t care if the whole Jaynstar disagree with me. You welcome to give your examples, I welcome to give mine.

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      • LeilaFan replied:

        @Funn, I am not wrong. You wrong.
        You call someone wrong, they can call you wrong back.
        I will not apoligize for anything I said. I will continue debate this with you.

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      • LeilaFan replied:

        Wrong what Funn? That I do not think all women would love to stay home like you say?
        OK, let go by your “MOST” statement. I still do not think MOST women would want to stay home, IF they have a well paid job and a good career.
        Just because I don’t agree with you that make me wrong? Haha!!!!
        And for your president examples, not all president wives make more than their husband. Not all president wife have better career than their husband. And if their husband was not president, do you think they willing to choose to stay home? Not if they want to have a good lifestyle and where 1 person income will not be able to give them that lifestyle.

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      • LeilaFan replied:

        @Kidd, you want to continue this debate, let debate.
        Secondly, what’s with this ‘if all’ argument? Anyone say all women want to stay home? Why is it have to be all or none to you? ———- You want to put it this way, OK then my statement now is “MOST women would still prefer working if they have a well paid job and a good career”

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      • Funn Lim replied:

        But you haven’t given any examples. You just keep repeating your views as if it represents the entire forum WHEN there are now 5 or so who is not of the same view as you. You persist with only yourself as an example and by making general statement that as if it applies to everyone without a doubt. You want to continue with this debate, I can too. Show me your examples but please save the capitals. Being dramatic is not an example. Give a good one, other than yourself. You alone do not represent everyone and generalising does not apply to everyone.

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      • LeilaFan replied:

        @Funn, I give alot of examples.

        Here you can answer this: Go to Yale and Harvard and ask all the future doctors and lawyers see if they want to stay home even if they married rich men.
        There are people who have passion for their career you know. Women doctors don’t just give up their doctors job and be stay home mom. There also women who love fame and money too you know, and will not give those up just to be stay home mom. Examples many actress still work as much as they can and make as much money, until they get around agfe 35-40 and then start to want to settle down, by that time they already make enough money.

        And answer this about your president examples: 1) Not all the president wife make more money than their husband.
        2) Not all the president wife have a better career than their husband.
        3) They stay home because their husband are president and making money enough for them to stay home. Do you think they will stay home if their husband is NOT president?

        Again, I say the same thing. WOMEN WOULD NOT PREFER STAY HOME IF THEY MAKE ALOT OF MONEY AND HAVE GOOD CAREERS!!

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      • LeilaFan replied:

        And here another examples I post above: I know a woman who have her own business store with 3 kids, and she is working because she enjoy having all those $100USD in her purse everyday that she make from her business. She, herself refuse to stay home, she hired a nanny to take care her 3 children instead.

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      • Funn Lim replied:

        Leilafan, stick to your principles. If you mean ALL, then stick with ALL. Don’t change from ALL to MOST to SOME. If you believe with what you think, then stick with it. Doesn’t make you right though. And I didn’t say ALL or MOST or whatever. I am saying your statement is wrong. What is wrong with your statement, which is something however much I say you won’t even see, is then pointless for me to point out because I thought I was rather clear.

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      • LeilaFan replied:

        Fine, then ALL.
        And you can answer my two post above.

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      • Kidd replied:

        Conclusion.

        Leilafan just don’t get it. She even misunderstood Jayne’s point.

        “ALL OR MOST WOMEN WOULD PREFER GO TO WORK IF THEY HAVE A JOB THAT PAY WELL OR A GOOD CAREER.”

        All along, people (including Jayne) are just trying to point out that not all women would want that. Some women want career, some women want home.

        No one has said ‘All women want to stay home’. But, because some of us think your ‘All or most women would prefer to go to work if they have a jog that pay well or good career’ is wrong, you immediate think we go the other extreme and think ‘all women want to stay home’.

        No, we didn’t think that. At least, I don’t. I’m not an absolutist like you. I think it’s 50/50.

        Lastly, no, I don’t need to you apologise or take back your word. So, no need to freak out.

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      • LeilaFan replied:

        @Funn, Heck yeah you did, you state ALOT
        Here is your quote OK: “Believe me a lot of women will rather stay at home and be a full time mom if they married financially capable husbands”
        And your statement I will say wrong.
        I said the same thing again, ALL WOMEN who making alot of money and have good career would prefer working instead of give up their job and stay home.

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      • LeilaFan replied:

        Back to the orignal posting way above:

        LeilaFan quote: No women want to stay home if they have a career and a good job.

        Funn quote: Believe me a lot of women will rather stay at home and be a full time mom if they married financially capable husbands.

        I said you wrong, you said I wrong, so let continue this debate.

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      • LeilaFan replied:

        Your quote Funn, Funn quote: Believe me a lot of women will rather stay at home and be a full time mom if they married financially capable husbands.

        My reply: EVEN WITH women who married rich husband still would love to work.Go to Yale and Harvard and ask all the future doctors and lawyers see if they want to stay home even if they married rich men.
        There are people who have passion for their career you know. Women doctors don’t just give up their doctors job and be stay home mom. There also women who love fame and money too you know, and will not give those up just to be stay home mom.
        Wait for you answer this.

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      • jayne replied:

        LeilaFan,
        “EVEN WITH women who married rich husband still would love to work.Go to Yale and Harvard and ask all the future doctors and lawyers see if they want to stay home even if they married rich men”

        Sometimes the intention of going to college is of course to explore a certain career. Even with the best education, the brightest career prospects, along the way, life circumstances will change. Marriage and kids will lead the even women with the brightest careers to re-evaluate what is more important to you in life.

        From time to time, the New York Times runs articles about well-educated women, doctors and lawyers, who change their values regarding career versus motherhood. This is an older article dated back in 2005, but the idea is the same and you can find more updated articles in recent years on this topic as well:

        Many Women at Elite Colleges Set Career Path to Motherhood
        http://www.nytimes.com/2005/09/20/national/20women.html?pagewanted=print

        With more well-educated women in this generation than compared to the 1970s or 1980s, this is a more pressing issue that women have to wonder. If given the financial ability to do so, are they willing to leave their jobs for motherhood?

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      • Funn Lim replied:

        “Believe me a lot of women will rather stay at home and be a full time mom if they married financially capable husbands”

        And I stand by my words. And I do mean a lot. Because someone has to make the sacrifice and if they’re able to they will. But what you said is absolute, and again insulting. Mine is a statement. Yours is different. Mine is a choice. Yours is a necessity as in without a choice; they stay either because they married rich old man or they don’t have a good paying job or career. Mine is simply if they can afford it they will.

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      • LeilaFan replied:

        You think my statement is insulting you, too bad. I am still waiting for you to answer my examples above.

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      • LeilaFan replied:

        Thank you for the article Jayne, but how many is many in there. Not many considered how many University are out there in United States.
        And those in your articles are mostly Asian with Asian views. Have you ever try to ask your white American neighbors around you in New York and see if they want to stay home?
        Or maybe ask American doctors in New York see if they willing to give up their job to stay home.

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      • jayne replied:

        LeilaFan,
        Since our personal views are limited by own personal experiences and the people we know, I thought we can read the article about the Harvard and Yale graduates, women who have a great education and bright career prospects, since we are on this topic.

        From the article, surveys were conducted on the alumni from these schools:

        “According to a 2000 survey of Yale alumni from the classes of 1979, 1984, 1989 and 1994, conducted by the Yale Office of Institutional Research, more men from each of those classes than women said that work was their primary activity – a gap that was small among alumni in their 20’s but widened as women moved into their prime child-rearing years. Among the alumni surveyed who had reached their 40’s, only 56 percent of the women still worked, compared with 90 percent of the men.

        A 2005 study of comparable Yale alumni classes found that the pattern had not changed. Among the alumni who had reached their early 40’s, just over half said work was their primary activity, compared with 90 percent of the men. Among the women who had reached their late 40’s, some said they had returned to work, but the percentage of women working was still far behind the percentage of men.

        A 2001 survey of Harvard Business School graduates found that 31 percent of the women from the classes of 1981, 1985 and 1991 who answered the survey worked only part time or on contract, and another 31 percent did not work at all, levels strikingly similar to the percentages of the Yale students interviewed who predicted they would stay at home or work part time in their 30’s and 40’s.”

        Although the number of respondents in the surveys were unclear, it is likely that hundreds, if not thousands, of people responded since the surveys were conducted over different years. The survey includes women of all races, not just Asian.

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      • Funn Lim replied:

        How do you expect me to answer your hypothesis when you don’t even answer my real examples? Fine I will answer hypothesis with hypothesis.

        “There are people who have passion for their career you know. Women doctors don’t just give up their doctors job and be stay home mom. There also women who love fame and money too you know, and will not give those up just to be stay home mom.’

        No doubt there are many passionate about their work and won’t give up their career. But the point is some do, and it is a matter of sacrifice but the point is they do. Are you telling me no doctors are stay at home mom? As for fame and money, there are actresses who give up on lucrative acting jobs or desirable roles to give birth and take care of their children for a few years. Some do retire. Two very good examples.

        Gwyneth Paltrow always said her mother sacrificed her career to be a full time mom.

        Momoe Yamaguchi, mega famous japanese singer/actress retired at her height of fame to start a family with her less successful actor husband and never looked back since

        http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Momoe_Yamaguchi

        I am sure there are few others.

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      • Funn Lim replied:

        Oh let’s ask the foreigners then. Many are what they call homemakers.

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      • LeilaFan replied:

        Whart are your real examples Funn? Your friends give up their work to stay home mother. Well my friends who rather work and have hundreds of $100USD bills in her wallet instead of stay home.
        You give examples of 2 actress who stay home mom. I can give you others examples of Hollywood actress who are married and still love acting and still working.

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      • clamine replied:

        I’m on Funn’s side cos’ I personally know many homemakers who gave up successful careers to tend to their kids. Said it was the best decision they have made and highly recommend to women who have the luxury to do so. They can’t be an all around superwoman so they choose to be a supermom and superwife. And yes, there are 2 former doctors, a chemist and many mid-managers.

        All I can say is each to her own. Staying home with kids may drive some women like LeilaFan nuts, to others it is their lifesaver to a harmonious family life.

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      • clamine replied:

        And oh, forgot to add they are all caucasians.

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      • LeilaFan replied:

        A 2001 survey of Harvard Business School graduates found that 31 percent of the women from the classes of 1981, 1985 and 1991 who answered the survey worked only part time or on contract, and another 31 percent did not work at all, levels strikingly similar to the percentages of the Yale students interviewed who predicted they would stay at home or work part time in their 30′s and 40′s. ————– 31% Jayne,
        And students even said that they would stay at home or work part time their 30’s and 40’s Jayne.
        That means they would at least work from their graduate age to their 30’s to make enough money or experience the work field first then work part time.
        So still back to my statement, MOST or ALL women would not give up work if they have a well paid job or a good career.

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      • Funn Lim replied:

        Leilafan, you said women who stay at home married rich old men or do not have a good paying job or career. I need only quote that japanese singer to debunk your entire line of argument. As for my real examples, well haven’t you read the responses? Aren’t those real?

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      • LeilaFan replied:

        clamine, And yes, there are 2 former doctors, a chemist and many mid-managers. ——— Your examples, I can give you mine. I know 1 people who in my University who is a dentist and one who is a doctor and married, who are still working full time and won’t give up work because they said that all those years of school, they want to make it worth it.

        So yours examples against mine. You have friends who willing to stay home mom, I have friends who willing to NOT be stay home mom.

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      • LeilaFan replied:

        @Funn, you said I never give you real examples, and I did in my above post.
        Your example of the 2 actress is real, and if I want to dig into this, I can find actresses who are still acting even after they married.
        And so what if your friend wants to be a stay home mom.
        All my friends and my co-workers at work they want to work and make money and have comfortable life and extra money instead of depend on one income.

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      • clamine replied:

        “NO WOMEN WOULD WANT TO STAY HOME IF SHE CAPABLE OF HAVING A WELL PAY JOB AND A CAREER.”

        My comment is just to refute your claim that’s all. In my own small circle of acquaintances, there are actually some professional women who wiilingly quit their jobs to stay home with their kids.

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      • clamine replied:

        @LeilaFan “And those in your articles are mostly Asian with Asian views. Have you ever try to ask your white American neighbors around you in New York and see if they want to stay home? Or maybe ask American doctors in New York see if they willing to give up their job to stay home.”

        My reply is also in response to your above challenge, since I live in a mostly white community.

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      • LeilaFan replied:

        And my examples above are examples to give you of a doctor and dentist who are working full time and they married.
        So what if you know profession who are willing to be stay home mom. I know profession who are willing to work after marriage.
        How about go tell all the nurses in the hospital to quit working and stay home. Nurse make alot, ask them if they loves $100USD bills more or can they stay home and not have those money.

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      • LeilaFan replied:

        clamine, so do I, and my community where I live, all white people are working and happy that they bring home money to themselves to their family.

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      • LeilaFan replied:

        and clamine, your examples are couple people in the whole city you live in.
        How about go around your whole white city and see if all those white women in your city are stay home mother, or better off ask them if they prefer stay home when they can make tons of money from their good careers.
        And about the statistic, it only 31% and in the 31% said that they willing to work until they hits 30’s or 40’s age and then work part time. None of them say they want to stay home mom after college.

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      • Kidd replied:

        @ Leilafan

        “And students even said that they would stay at home or work part time their 30′s and 40′s Jayne.
        That means they would at least work from their graduate age to their 30′s to make enough money or experience the work field first then work part time.
        So still back to my statement, MOST or ALL women would not give up work if they have a well paid job or a good career.”

        You should rephrase you statement to ‘Most or ALL women between the age of 20-30 would not give up work if they have a well paid job or good career’ since you discounted the statistic shown by Jayne because they are of women in the 30s an 40s.

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      • LeilaFan replied:

        I said again, MOST OR ALL WOMEN WOULD PREFER WORKING INSTEAD OF STAY AT HOME. That is what I think and I will continue debate about this with anyone.

        And here a recent statistic dated 2009.
        Women now make up almost half of the U.S. labor force, up from 38% in 1970. This nearly 40-year trend has been fueled by a broad public consensus about the changing role of women in society. A solid majority of Americans (75%) reject the idea that women should return to their traditional roles in society, and most believe that both husband and wife should contribute to the family income.

        According to data collected by the U.S. Bureau of Labor Statistics, 59% of women now work or are actively seeking employment. An even higher percentage of women with children ages 17 or younger (66%) work either full or part time. Among those working mothers, most (74%) work full time while 26% work part time.

        There, most women would prefer working instead of stay home.

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      • Kidd replied:

        “How about go tell all the nurses in the hospital to quit working and stay home. Nurse make alot, ask them if they loves $100USD bills more or can they stay home and not have those money.”

        Sigh. Another absolute statement.

        Why should clamine go tell the nurses to stay at home?

        All clamine said is there are women with high paying jobs and good career who are willing to quit and be a stay at home mom, which is the truth.

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      • LeilaFan replied:

        And I said here are women who not willing to quit work to stay at home, are also true, I see many of them at work and at my city.

        And my original statement was I said again, MOST OR ALL WOMEN WOULD PREFER WORKING INSTEAD OF STAY AT HOME IF THEY HAVE A GOOD PAID JOB OR A GOOD CAREER. That is what I think and I will continue debate about this with anyone.

        And here a recent statistic dated 2009.
        Women now make up almost half of the U.S. labor force, up from 38% in 1970. This nearly 40-year trend has been fueled by a broad public consensus about the changing role of women in society. A solid majority of Americans (75%) reject the idea that women should return to their traditional roles in society, and most believe that both husband and wife should contribute to the family income.

        According to data collected by the U.S. Bureau of Labor Statistics, 59% of women now work or are actively seeking employment. An even higher percentage of women with children ages 17 or younger (66%) work either full or part time. Among those working mothers, most (74%) work full time while 26% work part time.

        There, most women would prefer working instead of stay home.

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      • Funn Lim replied:

        I think you divert from your original statement. You said those with good pay or career will not quit to become housewives. Those who are married rich old men or does not have good pay or career. That was your original statement. It isn’t about how many stayed at home, how many continued working. Go back to your original statement because every argument after is about that.

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      • LeilaFan replied:

        This is my statement from above.
        My exact word cut and paste to you:
        no women want to stay home if they have a career and a good job.
        Those who stay home are those married rich old men or those who are just do not have jobs, or jobs that make way less than their husband.

        No women want to stay him if she have a well paid job and a career. AND women stay home are women who married rich men (who make enough to sponser their life), have no jobs (no job or not employ, then they stay home) or make much less than their husband (if husband make much more, and wife not bring home that much, then she might as well stay home)

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      • Funn Lim replied:

        “There, most women would prefer working instead of stay home.” .. “IF THEY HAVE A GOOD PAID JOB OR A GOOD CAREER”, so therefore those who stay at home do not have good paid jobs or good career. Correct?

        And that is why it started the entire thing. This is simply wrong.

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      • LeilaFan replied:

        Everything I write is all above, my response and the statistic I give was to reply other posts such as clamine.
        And I still believe any women who capable of making $50,000 USD or more a year will not give up their job just to stay home.
        Here are real life examples I post to you:
        2 friends of mine, a dentist and a doctor, who refuse to stay home.
        Just like any nurse you find in hospital will also refuse to stay home (majority of them will refuse to stay home)
        I, myself refuse to stay home and give up my jobs when I am capable of making $4,000 USD a month.

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      • Funn Lim replied:

        “no women want to stay home if they have a career and a good job.
        Those who stay home are those married rich old men or those who are just do not have jobs, or jobs that make way less than their husband.
        No women want to stay him if she have a well paid job and a career. AND women stay home are women who married rich men (who make enough to sponser their life), have no jobs (no job or not employ, then they stay home) or make much less than their husband (if husband make much more, and wife not bring home that much, then she might as well stay home)”

        So these are your original statements which you stand by? Correct?

        Each is wrong wrong wrong. If you don’t see what’s wrong with these statements, then frankly even if I can draw till the intestines you won’t see beyond that huge ego of yours. My one example of that Japanese singer will debunk each and every statement of yours. Don’t show me statistics. It isn’t about statistics anymore but your original statement which you stand by. And if you stand by them, and if you say “no women want to stay home if they have a career and a good job.” and if I can show you one example, your entire line of statement is therefore proven conclusively wrong. More so we now have a few others posting their examples, so you have more than 1.

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      • anya replied:

        @leilafan: even it say 100% of women working not mean all of them want to work if they have a choice. Financial crisis, high demand lifestyle, everything you go is money, money….it not allowed women staying at home as they want. Many men losing the jobs, so of course if women who capable of earning money will have to go out and work their butt off to feed their husbands and children. But even 100% women working, I still believe at least haft of them willing to stay home.

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      • LeilaFan replied:

        Majority of stay home mom are not have good career and well paid job. Usually saty home mom make less than their husband, because they can depend on their husband income to pay bills, so they can stay home.

        Here the statistic for you below. Even research said, stay at home mom have less income and education than working mothers.

        According to a 2007 Pew Research Center survey, these at-home moms are slightly younger, on average, than moms who work full or part time. They have less formal education and lower household incomes than working mothers.

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      • LeilaFan replied:

        I don’t care if you think my statement is rong Funn, I think my statemnt is right. You can argue with me about this until next year if you want. We can go back and forth about our own examples of our friends, co-workers and our surrounding.
        I will said the same thing, Women who have well paid job and good career will likely to give up just to be stay home mom.

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      • Funn Lim replied:

        You can’t quote statistics. Because your statement does not get proven by your statistics but rather disproved by us showing our examples or statistics. You made a sweeping general statement; for example if I say “All women of lesser background marries rich are gold diggers”, it doesn’t matter how many gold diggers I can quote, if someone can tell me one example who is not, that statement is therefore wrong. That is how general statements, rebuttals work.

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      • Funn Lim replied:

        “Women who have well paid job and good career will likely to give up just to be stay home mom.”

        Well thank you. You have just agreed with me. Case closed.

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      • LeilaFan replied:

        Here are real life examples I post to you:
        2 friends of mine, a dentist and a doctor, who refuse to stay home.
        Just like any nurse you find in hospital will also refuse to stay home (majority of them will refuse to stay home)
        I, myself refuse to stay home and give up my jobs when I am capable of making $4,000 USD a month.

        And a statistic research to show you:
        According to a 2007 Pew Research Center survey, these at-home moms are slightly younger, on average, than moms who work full or part time. They have less formal education and lower household incomes than working mothers.

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      • ita replied:

        @leilafan

        “NO WOMEN WOULD WANT TO STAY HOME IF SHE CAPABLE OF HAVING A WELL PAY JOB AND A CAREER.”

        Your statement indeed is very harsh to most SAHM. I gave up my career once i have my kids. And lots of my friends do that to. I don’t want to flaunt about how educated we are but for sure it’s not worst than you. Either stay home or not it’s all come down to one word “Sacrifice”. You stay home, You have to sacrifice your career. If you go to work than you have to lose quite alot of time that you can spend w/ your kids, seeing them do things for the 1st time etc. Some of my friends even part time home school their kids. Being SAHM is not something being force or no choice. It’s a sacrifice.

        From your above statement sounds like all SAHM force to stay home because they are not capable of getting a job. And i don’t think it’s very true at all.

        I’m not asking you to change your opinion but when you made a comment you don’t speak/represent the SAHM. So don’t generalize. You are too educated to made that kind of assumption.

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      • LeilaFan replied:

        No close Funn, that was a typo. I was typing fast and cut and paste the statistic for you, so I miss out on 1 word.
        What I mean is:
        “Women who have well paid job and good career will NOT, NOT, NOT, NOT likely to give up just to be stay home mom.”

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      • LeilaFan replied:

        @ita, so what if I assumpt? That is my rights, you don’t like it you can argue with me.
        Again, I will said “NO WOMEN WOULD WANT TO STAY HOME IF SHE CAPABLE OF HAVING A WELL PAY JOB AND A CAREER.”
        That is what I think and that is what I will forever think.
        You said you give up your job to stay home? Well my co-workers didn’t give up their job to stay home.

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      • Funn Lim replied:

        ““Women who have well paid job and good career will NOT, NOT, NOT, NOT likely to give up just to be stay home mom.””

        Not likely doesn’t mean they won’t and not likely doesn’t mean they don’t. Because reality is they do. Successful women, and even men gave up high flying career for the sake of the family, some for children, some to save their marriage. You’re saying NOT, or even NOT LIKELY and I am saying some do and when some do, then your statement is again wrong. Because you first said ALL, then said MOST, now you say most likely or not likely. Well if you say not likely then there isn’t much to say but that wasn’t what you originally said which you still stand by. You’re going on again with generalising statements that slaps homemakers around the world, some of your fellow peers here are homemakers, and they have voiced out their reasons why they left their jobs and yet you persist on emphasising on that generalising as if EVERYONE is of that same generalising if one is a working career women who’s married or a homemaker. In the end the very basic of your statement, that a homemaker is someone who doesn’t have a good job or career or married rich old men is a slap on such women’s faces. You’re looking down on homemaker and your only basis of justification is you yourself, working, earning a good living, not giving up work. Well good for you, but that’s you. That is your choice, you do what you want to do the way you do it, doesn’t mean the way you do things are the way things are. The world does not revolve on the way you do things; everybody has their reasons, their purpose, their way in handling matters. My point is not all homemakers are useless, stupid career-less low paying former workers who now stay at home because husband earns more or they married rich. It is a conscious decision, sometimes out of choice, sometimes out of necessity, it is in the end a lifestyle choice. And who are you to condemn them with your general sweeping statement that you imply but to me might as well shout out how little you think of these group of women? How highly you think of yourself? What makes you better than them? Because you work, you are married, with kids, you choose your career, you can juggle it all whilst these women who preferred to give up some aspect of their lives can’t? You think too highly of yourself, and you’re entitled to think anyway of yourself but to keep going on and on and on about in the end how highly of yourself which you deserve a pat on the back for a job well done compared to how lowly of these group of women, whether with children or not, are to me what’s insulting.You want to go on about this so be it, I can go on until Jayne bans us both. I am not going to change your mind, I am done with that, but I am going to assert the same thing I have been trying to point out; you are wrong. You may think you are right, but that is you saying you’re right to yourself. Here we have fellow peers saying you’re wrong, and I stand by them. You’re absolutely utterly wrong.

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      • LeilaFan replied:

        @Funn, I am NOT wrong. You wrong. And I will stand with my statement “Women with high paid job and good career will not likely to give up their work to be stay home mom.”
        I do not look on down on any housewife, you are the person who wish to married rich and get offended because you yourself want to be a stay home mom.
        I state my views, and if you dislike it, live with it. Because nothing you write in here or anyone write in here can change my views.
        It takes 2 to tangle, I am not here talking to myself. I am here replies back to your replies. If you keep reply to me and give me examples of your friends are stay home mom. Then I will keep replies back to you and give you example sof my friends and my co-workers are NOT stay home mom, simple as that.

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      • LeilaFan replied:

        Fine, my statement “Women who have well paid job and good career will NOT give up just to be stay home mom.”
        That is what I think and what I will forever think. If Funn you want to keep debate and replies me, feel free. I will continue to replies to you. Because what ever you replies will not change my mind, and I will not apoligize to any housewife for the statement I said above.

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      • Funn Lim replied:

        I have never given you examples of my friends who are stay at home moms. And you can keep telling yourself that, keep convincing yourself because as far as I am concerned, my fellow peers think you’re absolutely wrong. Whether they feel offended is their prerogotive but they do think you’re absolutely wrong.

        And how am I wrong when everyone seems to think you are wrong? Because your opinion matters above all others even when we have those of similar experience stepping up and telling us their life stories which you dismiss? Don’t they count? Because your friends count more?

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      • Funn Lim replied:

        “you are the person who wish to married rich and get offended because you yourself want to be a stay home mom.”

        Leilafan, I wish, but doesn’t mean I am. I want, doesn’t mean I did. And I am not offended because I want to be stay at home mom, I am offended because by your reasoning, if I stay at home, it means my career was tanking or I didn’t find job fulfilment or I married old rich man. Which means either I am unsuccessful, useless or a gold digger.

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      • ita replied:

        @leilafan
        nah i’m not going to argue with a knuckle head who don’t even know what’s wrong with her own statement.

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      • LeilaFan replied:

        Haha!! Wrongs or rights is depend on what people views.
        This is not a moral issue where you can say in court by law that robbery is wrong.
        This debate is about how I see things compared to how you see things.
        I don’t care who in here think you right. I will continue to debate this with them too.
        As for who in here on your side does not apply to 6 billions people in this world. And there are many people who thinks I am right. Post my statement “Any women with high paid job or good career will not give it up to be a stay home mom” in any American forum and let them debate and see if any of them find my statement to be an “insult” like how you claim Funn.
        There are 7 people (Funn, LeilaFan, Jayne, claimine, ita, anya, lol) replies to this thread. And 2 active people still replies back and forth about this is you and me.

        I said that women stay home mom are those have lesser education and less paid job than work mom. This is mostly true since I already give you a research statistic show that stay home mom have less degree than working mom.
        You give me examples of 2 Japanese actress who live in a Japanese culture of where a woman serve a man to be a stay home mom, Haha! I can give you back 2 Hollywood actress who are still working after they married.
        As for people who give me examples of their friends give up their work to stay home. I give back my examples of my friends who are still working despite that they are married.
        So to conclude. I will not change my view, you will not change your view. We can continue give examples back and forth and debate this, but it won’t change any of our views I can garuantee that, as I won’t apoligize to any stay home mom for my statement.

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      • LeilaFan replied:

        @ita, nah i’m not going to argue with a knuckle head who don’t even know what’s wrong with her own statement. ——— and I won’t argue with you, a person who have nothing to do beside going online to argue back and forth with me, someone who you know will NOT change my viewpoints.

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      • LeilaFan replied:

        I am offended because by your reasoning, ——— too bad, that is life. Learn to live with it or ignore it. In life nobody will say things just to make you happy. So what if my reasoning offended you, it is you that offended, you only bring uncomfortable to yourself by feeling offended.
        I will not apoligize to you or any house wife on my statement of this whole debate.

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      • LeilaFan replied:

        The world does not revolve on the way you do things; everybody has their reasons, their purpose, their way in handling matters. ————– @Funn, you right Funn, and the world does not revolve on the way you feel offended on certain things I said. Everyone have their viewpoinst and beliefts, regardless if you happy that they kiss your a-s-s or if you feel uncomfortable that they offended you!

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      • HeTieShou replied:

        @Veejay,
        Oh I know that it is very exhausting to do housework and all because I do it all the time since my mom is sexist. Even when I had school and all, I still had do it all while my brothers did not do a thing. One of my friends stays home, but doesn’t need to do much and even gets money to spend so I sort of don’t think that is right. But generally, I know and understand that housewives do A LOT of things that people often take for granted. I know that since I suffer through that due to growing up in a sexist family with all brothers… The career women gets all of the credit while housewives don’t get any and I don’t find that fair. I think it is great for a woman to work but if she can’t then she will contribute elsewhere… It was LeilaFan not me that disapproves of women staying home. I was just asking how everyone felt about that…

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      • LeilaFan replied:

        So what if I think women should go to work. So what if I write that “Women would not give up their job if they making alot of money or have good career”. That is what I think, and if you find that insulting by what a person on the internet say, tough luck for you. Rather ignore it, or we can continue this debate.
        And I don’t care who stay home housewife, that is their business. I live in USA, I have the rights to my freedom of speech, and I ain’t going to change my words just to make anyone happy.

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      • Chriselle replied:

        @LeilaFan,

        This topic and thread has spammed the recent comments enough. I went to bed last night reading this and there are still comments going on when I woke up. I daresay this is the longest debate ever on here.

        In your past comments on Jaynestars you gave me the impression that you were hardworking and mature person who doesn’t like to rely on people, but your comments have always came across as every extreme and like Kidd said, with absolutist-thinking. Over and over, Jayne, Kidd, Funn, and others have given personal examples as well as statistic to prove their case, but you keep repeating over and over the same point. I don’t even see how this is an intelligent debate anymore. It’s all about you asking everyone else to go back to read what you wrote. And when you can’t prove your point, you capitalize all your letters. It really seems like your are shouting your lines if this was a face-to-face debate.

        From what I see you are a very opinionated individual who isn’t open-minded to the opinions and views of others. Yes, we are all entitled to our own opinions, but our opinions are not everything. It doesn’t make you always right, especially when there are numerous rebuttals thrown at you that proved your generalization wrong already. I think I’ve debated with you a few times (not as intense as this one), and you never seem to see the opposite side’s perspective. You tend to claim that it’s your own opinion, which of course, is fine. But a good debate requires not only for both sides to have their own opinions, but also be open-minded and understand your opposing side’s viewpoint and logically rebuttal them. Sorry, but your arguments and rebuttals seems like a little girl throwing tantrums, misunderstanding your opponent’s views, being extremely defensive (and even disrespecting people by claiming that you don’t care about their feelings and such), and not getting a grasp of the entire situation into perspective.

        TBH, this is how I see things. When debating with Jayne and Kidd, they are open-minded individuals who analyze things carefully and see from both sides of the argument. But you are blindly believing in your case and even if real life statistics, you stay with your extremist POVs, which um sorry to admit, makes it right for ita to call you a knucklehead.

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      • LeilaFan replied:

        @Chriselle, it takes 2 to tangle. If they keep replies me, I will replies back.
        And no, my generalization is not Wrong. And I am not Wrong!
        You and they think most women would want to be a stay home mom. I said again, MOst women with good paid job and good career will NOT be a stay home mom.
        Go to the hospital and ask those nurse if they willing to give up their money and to stay home. And if they would, then you won’t be seeing any nurse anymore in hospital.
        Same with doctors, so what if 1 doctor give up doctors job to stay home. There are millions of doctors in this world who are still working and married.
        And for me, I do not give my all my hundreds dollars bills to be a stay mom mama.
        This is what I do, this is what I think, and this is what I will continue to voice my viewpoints of this issue. If they continue to replie to me, I will continue to replies back. I’m not talking t myself, they all talking to me. And I enjoy seeing them get mad, the more Funn get mad over what I write on the Internet, the more happy I am. Haha!

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      • LeilaFan replied:

        @Chriselle, I do not just give me co-workers examples. I give real statistic examples too. Maybe you didn’t read.

        Here a recent statistic dated 2009.
        Women now make up almost half of the U.S. labor force, up from 38% in 1970. This nearly 40-year trend has been fueled by a broad public consensus about the changing role of women in society. A solid majority of Americans (75%) reject the idea that women should return to their traditional roles in society, and most believe that both husband and wife should contribute to the family income.

        According to data collected by the U.S. Bureau of Labor Statistics, 59% of women now work or are actively seeking employment. An even higher percentage of women with children ages 17 or younger (66%) work either full or part time. Among those working mothers, most (74%) work full time while 26% work part time.

        There, most women would prefer working instead of stay home. Proven I am right.

        And here another one. And a statistic research to show you:
        According to a 2007 Pew Research Center survey, these at-home moms are slightly younger, on average, than moms who work full or part time. They have less formal education and lower household incomes than working mothers.

        Which proven my statemnet right is that most women stay home do not haev high education as women working.

        And one other thing, so what if I am absolute, and if you find my debate boring, you don’t have to join. You join in my debate, then you are no better than me.

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      • LeilaFan replied:

        Sorry, but your arguments and rebuttals seems like a little girl throwing tantrums, misunderstanding your opponent’s views. ——– You call me a little girl and you here replies to me, you are no better. You claim you adult and mature and you keep replies to little girl, Haha!!
        I did not misunderstand anyone views, they just refuse to accept my views and move on but keep come back and replies to me. I will not change my views regardless how long this thread will get.

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      • Chriselle replied:

        “If they keep replies me, I will replies back.”

        You are not replying to them. You’re just repeating yourself over and over. You always fail to understand their point.

        “And no, my generalization is not Wrong. And I am not Wrong!
        You and they think most women would want to be a stay home mom.”

        There you go again. Generalizing! You must have mistaken me for someone who cares about this debate. If you go back and THOROUGHLY read my comment, I didn’t state that I’m siding with anyone. I have no opinion on this matter of housewives, but I do respect them for sacrificing now after hearing their views. 🙂

        “And I enjoy seeing them get mad, the more Funn get mad over what I write on the Internet, the more happy I am. ”

        Once again, you show your immaturity. I didn’t sense that Funn or any of the others were mad, but confused that you don’t understand the argument. You seem to be the one whose all heated up and defensive.

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      • LeilaFan replied:

        Haha! Funn is a person who wish to married rich and want to stay home and not working, that is why she keep wants to debate with me and defend her “stay home mother” role.
        She mad or not, or if she feel uncomfortable on what I write, ask herself, she knows the answer.
        She keep replies to me, I keep replies back.
        And Chriselle, before you call someone immature, be a role model and prove you are more mature than them. Calling me immature but keep feeding me with your replies, you are not better.

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      • LeilaFan replied:

        This topic and thread has spammed the recent comments enough. ——– If you think I spammed, then stop feeding me so I can have a reason to keep reply and defend my points and keep spamming this thread.

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      • LeilaFan replied:

        You are not replying to them. You’re just repeating yourself over and over. You always fail to understand their point. ———- I did reply. They said their little doctor friends give up jobs to stay home. I said my friends and my co-workers are all working and refuse to give up jobs.
        They said most women want to stay home. I said most women want to go to work making alot of money.
        How is that not replies? Any examples they give, I give my own examples back. They give statistic, I also give my statistic above. You not read?

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      • LeilaFan replied:

        You are not replying to them. You’re just repeating yourself over and over. ——- So are they, I repeating myself over and over that women who have good jobs and good career will not stay home. They also repeating same thing over and over again that women loves to stay home and be stay home mother.

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      • Chriselle replied:

        “And Chriselle, before you call someone immature, be a role model and prove you are more mature than them. ”

        So let’s say I’m going to be a role model, will you follow me? 😉

        “And one other thing, so what if I am absolute, and if you find my debate boring, you don’t have to join.”

        Oh, there’s nothing wrong with being an absolutist if you think offending lots of people on this forum doesn’t mean a single thing to you, which obviously doesn’t as displayed by your words and actions. The truth is, if you don’t see anything wrong with it, I don’t either. Because I wasn’t the one who offended them. 😛

        “If you think I spammed, then stop feeding me so I can have a reason to keep reply and defend my points and keep spamming this thread.”

        You’re right. Maybe I should just shut up. 🙂

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      • LeilaFan replied:

        Here the original posting.

        LeilaFan said: most women will not stay home if she make alot of mney and have a career and a good job.

        Funn said: most women would love to stay home if their husband make enough to support the family.

        This is 2 different viewpoints and opinions. There won’t be any debate if Funn didn’t keep replies to me and said that I “insult” housewives.

        And yes, if nobody keep writing MY NAME “LeilaFan” and try to lecture me on how I should think, then I have no reason to replies back. Funn just have to accept my viewpoints and move on. I just have to accept her viewpoints and move on.

        I will stop comment on this thread until I see someone bring up my name “LeilaFan” and try to change my mind, then I have no choice but to replies and defend myself.

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      • Kidd replied:

        @ Leilafan

        “And I enjoy seeing them get mad, the more Funn get mad over what I write on the Internet, the more happy I am. Haha!”

        From what I see, you are equally mad. The ‘Haha’ at the back can’t hide the feelings you have shown throughout the debate. 😛

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      • LeilaFan replied:

        @Kidd. I state in my post, it takes 2 to tangles. As you replies to me, I will just replies back.
        Sure, since we all still dwelling over this issue, then there obviously no agreement on our viewpoints.
        I am willing to debate this to next year if I have to. So let continue.

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      • Kidd replied:

        “@Kidd. I state in my post, it takes 2 to tangles. As you replies to me, I will just replies back.
        Sure, since we all still dwelling over this issue, then there obviously no agreement on our viewpoints.
        I am willing to debate this to next year if I have to. So let continue.”

        There’s nothing to debate or continue since you didn’t even address my point. You are just replying for the sake of replying and be the one having the last word.

        You not addressing my point (neither admit or deny that your are equally mad) but answer with something different confirms my impression that you are indeed mad (mad as in angry). 😛

        Anyway, this is my last post on this ‘debate’. You can reply if you want and be the last one standing. But, I can only say for myself. I can’t guarantee others won’t reply. 🙂

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      • LeilaFan replied:

        Sure let others replies, I don’t mind drag this on until whenever it takes.

        And answer you, No, I am not mad. I just refuse to agree with you or Funn, and I remain with my statement as of I show in my statistic and examples I write all above.

        So here again, my statement: WOMEN WITH WELL PAID JOB AND GOOD CAREER WILL PREFER WORKING AND NOT BE A STAY HOME MOM.

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      • LeilaFan replied:

        So here again, my statement: WOMEN WITH WELL PAID JOB AND GOOD CAREER WILL PREFER WORKING AND NOT BE A STAY HOME MOM. —— and if anyone find my statement to be insulting, go cries to your husband or your parents, LMFAO!!!
        I will not change my statement for anyone. Rather accept that is how I think or keep debate with me. I am waiting to continue this if anyone keep post replies.

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      • Fox replied:

        Sorry for joining the debate in the end:

        WOMEN WITH WELL PAID JOB AND GOOD CAREER WILL PREFER WORKING AND NOT BE A STAY HOME MOM.

        I dun agree. Many women blv that kids are their biggest assets so they should take care for them more than having a good job or a lot of money. That’s why they choose to stay at home and take care for the children, especially in a risky world like nowaday.

        Young women might like to work than stay at home, but when they are older, to the age of 40, family is their biggest concern. Their kids will be in the dangerous time at this moment (teenagers) and a lot of them, if they already has a stable economic background, will like to spend time at home more than outdoor activities.

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      • LeilaFan replied:

        This I agree with Fox. Nowadays in USA economy is very bad, many women stay at home to take care of their kids. Many women are now looking for work and not able to find one.
        And I also agree with the older the women get, the more she will want to stay home. But remember, this is the older women. Newly graduated and college students will not give up their career and be a home mom.
        And for my statement, whether you agree or disagree is up to each person. As for me, I don’t want to stay home when I can make money. Like you said, money is so important these days, then who would not love having all those cash in their wallet instead.
        I still believe that women with good high paying would not want to stay home. Maybe there are some, but certainly that is in the minority, not the majority.

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      • josie replied:

        wah, why the need for name-calling?

        I actually agree w/ leilafan and don’t care if the real housewives are insulted!

        My original comment was in response to HTS wondering why joel is condemned for free-loading and housewives who don’t work, are not. I said housewives do a lot of work so they earned the right to spend their husband’s money.

        But I would never want to do that kind of work every day for the rest of my life! If I had to stay home all day with the kids and talk baby talk, I think I would go insane. I need to have intelligent conversation w/ other adults please!

        I think the best of both worlds is to work part time so that u can feel good about working and still having time for the family. Maybe some women can’t afford daycare so it’s more feasible to stay home or maybe some women didn’t really enjoy their previous job so they prefer to be full time mom. But for the ones who did have a good career and quit, are they sure they won’t regret it later? Like someone said their doctor friend gave up their job to be a housewife. I think that’s a shame b/c she could still help many people by working part-time or per diem at clinics.

        And Michelle Obama is not a housewife! Pure housewife is someone who has no outside job. Mrs. Obama’s job as first lady entails a lot of charity work, speaking engagements to motivate young people, and many other children’s programs. That is very fullfilling work so it’s not a waste that she no longer pracices law.

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      • LeilaFan replied:

        Thank you josie. I actually don’t care what is their viewpoints since I said many times we all have our opinions.
        What bother me is that they seem like they can’t even accept a difference opinion from me.
        So what if I write that “women with high paid jobs will not stay home”. That is how I feel, so leave it at that. No need to keep replies back to me and keep lecturing me how I should think a certain way about housewife.
        Move on, this is the Internet. They already make their points clear, I already make my clear, and obviously none of us will change the ways we see things, so leave it at this. Nothing else left to debate about.

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      • Chriselle replied:

        “What bother me is that they seem like they can’t even accept a difference opinion from me.”

        Oh, look whose talking! 😀

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      • LeilaFan replied:

        Tough luck for you Chriselle, too bad I do not see things your ways or have to think a certains ways like you.
        I do not find anything I write is offensivem, if you find that offensive then too bad for you. You can go cries to your parents or your husband to give you comfort, because this Internet girl LeilaFan will not change her viewpoints just to satisfy anyone.

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      • Chriselle replied:

        The only reason I would be sad is prolly for you because you seemed to be 100% clueless what “Oh, look who’s talking!” meant.

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      • LeilaFan replied:

        Yup @Chriselle and I feel sad for you too, since you keep talking to a clueless person like me, Aww!!!

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      • LeilaFan replied:

        And I don’t care if this statement of mine
        WOMEN WITH WELL PAID JOB AND GOOD CAREER WILL PREFER WORKING AND NOT BE A STAY HOME MOM.” offended you, or anyone here or any housewife. Too bad, go cries if I offended you.

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      • Veejay replied:

        Not trying to side any party here but for this comemnt on

        “WOMEN WITH WELL PAID JOB AND GOOD CAREER WILL PREFER WORKING AND NOT BE A STAY HOME MOM.”

        I’ve seen some women rather work rather than taking care of kids at home even if her husband is willing to take care of her and family and pay every each cent. Like for eg, one of the accountant lady who works in my company, she earns really high pay a month and her husband is a doctor and my point is, both probably have no prob with managing their bills etc..I truly doubt even if her husband asks her to quit job one day and to become a full time housewife, I doubt she will say agree! because from my experiences knowing such ppl like this, mostly doesn’t want to stay home if there current earning is pretty good. Maybe they didnt want to stop what is flowing to their pockets..

        As for Leilafan’s bragging how good life seh has in Usa..i wont state my comemnt since I dont know life in usa well 😀

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      • LeilaFan replied:

        Thank you Veejay. That is what I am saying in my quote. I still believe that if a woman make alot of money, she will not want to be a stay home mom when she can bring home all the mney for her to spend herself, and for her family.
        Life in USA is not perfect but much better than China Veejay. I was lucky to have a gree and able to get a good job. This is why I will NOT easily give up my job just to be a stay home mom. Not when my degree are from my hardworking 4 years of study, and I want to make my degree worth it. Many said money is important, I need the money so helps out my family especially we buy a house and we need to pay monthly payments, and ofcourse money for me to buy clothes and beautify myself too. No way I will stay at home. And if those who think what I said is an insult to stay home wife, too bad for you, Haha!

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      • sure-lee replied:

        @LeilaFan

        I am sure there are woman who have high paying careers that would rather stay home. First of all, why wouldn’t anyone want to stay home and enjoy life? Of course, unless you’re a super rich lady that stays home every day already and got bored of it. Other than that, I can’t think of any reason why woman would not want to stay home to enjoy life. But I’m going to make myself clear. To WANT and being ABLE to are two different things. Few woman CAN actually stay home. Most woman must continue working every day to provide for their families. That’s because they believe their family is in need of the income, and there’s no reason for them to stop. If someone automatically starts giving you a decent income without you having to go to work, wouldn’t you accept that? I believe every woman would! Until you reach the point of boredom, from staying at home too long. That would then be the point in where you want a job, just to spend some time.

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      • LeilaFan replied:

        @sure-lee If someone automatically starts giving you a decent income without you having to go to work, wouldn’t you accept that? I believe every woman would! ——— Wrong, I have a degree, I work since I was 18, and I love my job and I will not give up my work for anyone give me income. I don’t need anyone give me income, I have my own income.
        And to answer your question, you sure there are women who have high career and give it up for their children, that is your examples. I am sure there are women who have high degree and NOT willing to give it up to be at home, such as 2 people I know, a doctor and a dentist who will not give up work and they are married.

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      • sure-lee replied:

        @LeilaFan

        They won’t give up their careers because like I said, they believe they still need their source of income. It’s either that, or they still WANT their income. Okay, let’s change a way to say this. If you tell that dentist/doctor that he/she will get the same amount of money by staying home, without havibg to go to work, will they accept it? I’m not sure of their answer, but I can guarantee you they will accept it for a matter of time! Unless they get bored at home and want to return to their career.

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      • LeilaFan replied:

        Wrong again sure-lee. If all Doctors are like you who rather stay home and not work then there be no female doctors left in this world. There are people who loves the profession you know.
        There are example above of those who family are both doctors or well paid and both are still working.
        Take a look at Cecilia Cheung, after she married Nic, with Nic income and her income for all those years, she can stay home and be with her 2 sons. But guess what, she still working, taking movies after movies.
        So your statement of those who are rich or have the money will stop working is WRONG!!

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      • sure-lee replied:

        @LeilaFan

        You don’t have to agree with me. But you can’t really say that I’m wrong, because I bet you there are people who would love staying home, even they they do get a high salary. Everything possibility exists you know.

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      • Funn Lim replied:

        sure-lee, take my advice and save your breath. Her problem is her English. Because she makes no difference between want, wish, able to, might, will, most likely, likely, probably, possibly, etc. Her statement is all and she cites herself as an example which to her is the only ever valid example, notwithstanding what everyone has put up. To Leilafan, all the stay at home mothers are not doctors, lawyers etc. No doctors, dentists, lawyers, etc are stay at home mom unless of course they failed at their careers. So for her, she is successful in her career, whatever her job may be since she feels no need to be a housewife. Not even stay at home mom, but housewife. So everyone else who is a housewife, they’re all by her definition failure at their jobs and careers or husbands earn more than they do therefore they stay at home. So we have a high percentage of failed career women, don’t we?

        And perhaps a higher percentage of ultra successful women who sees no need to ever quit their jobs and become housewives because if they do, it means they’re a failure in their work. Because it is either don’t quit = successful or quit = failure. And the most often quoted examples, Leilafan herself.

        As for lawyers and doctors and what nots, they are so successful, no female doctors, lawyers, nurses, astronauts, accountants, etc ever quit to be a homemaker. No one. By her definition.

        And those who are homemakers, they’re uneducated because she cited educated folks so to speak.

        So non intelligent unsuccessful failed career women without a good paying job BUT is lucky is enough to marry a man who makes more than they do ends up being home maker. And therefore by her reasonings home makers are failed career women.

        And still she doesn’t see what is so offending or offensive. Because you see, she is a married working career woman, she is successful, other homemakers are not, therefore she doesn’t see other people’s point of view.

        And if that is the case, well, let me be a failed career woman who is lucky enough to marry a rich guy, because if that is what it takes for me to be a homemaker, well, so be it.

        And again, I cited my personal preference when I said wish to marry rich and not work. What Leilafan did was to impose a generalisation on ALL female.

        And she will indeed ask for statistics, examples but whatever we give, they’re not valid unless we quote her as an example. She is her own statistics, she is her own example. How can you ever reason against that??

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      • LeilaFan replied:

        I can’t say you wrong then what make you think they can said I am wrong?
        This is not a moral ethnic issue where you can said that robbery is wrong. This is a matter of opinions.
        You give your examples of the women you see who willing to sacrify careers for stay home. Fine, that is what you see, be it.
        Then I give MY EXAMPLES of those women who are doctors and dentist who love their passion and refuse to give up their career, and be a stay home mom. Fine too, that is what I see of the people around me.
        Wrong what! Nobody is wrong here, this is a matter if different opinions. You call me wrong, so I call you wrong back, simply as that.

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      • Funn Lim replied:

        There may not be right or wrong in opinion but there are times when someone can be so utterly wrong. You’re wrong Leilafan. Not your examples, they can’t be wrong but your generalisation is wrong.

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      • sure-lee replied:

        @LeilaFan

        I never said you were wrong. I just expressed my viewpoints about this. I understand that some people simply enjoy their career, but again, the word “money” if often, if not always (according to your opinion) a huge factor.

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      • LeilaFan replied:

        Funn, so what if I think those stay at home are those with lesser degree and make lesser income. I think that, and? We can talk about this until next year and let see if my opinions will change or not OK.
        According to a 2007 Pew Research Center survey, these at-home moms are slightly younger, on average, than moms who work full or part time. They have less formal education and lower household incomes than working mothers. ——- and I think that based on this research survey. And? You don’t like this survey? Too bad for you.

        And I still said that women who are on top of their height career will refuse to stay home. THE MAJORITY WILL NOT GIVE UP THEIR HIGH PAY JOB TO STAY HOME. So we back to square one on this argument, none of us willing to change our minds, so let continue this debate if you insist.

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      • LeilaFan replied:

        Funn, I am NOT WRONG!
        And my generalization is not wrong, so what is I generalize? Hell will freezes over just because this girl LeilaFan will never agree with you on this issue and will never say I am wrong.
        I still said women who have high pay jobs who can bring home alot of cash will NOT be a housewife.

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      • LeilaFan replied:

        @sure-lee, you give your viewpoints, I give mine. You give you examples, I give mine. So let it be, we all have our opinions on things.

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      • LeilaFan replied:

        @Funn, You’re wrong Leilafan. ——– No! I am not wrong, You wrong Funn. We can continue this until when ever you like. Everytime you type I am wrong, I will type you wrong back.

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  2. lara says:

    Is Joel using his brother’s money to fund him and Florinda’s dates?

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    • Jayne replied:

      Lara,
      Joel uses money from his brother to finance his lifestyle, which would obviously include dining dates with Florinda, taking frequent international flights to Great Britain (where Florinda is studying), purchasing gifts, not to mention Joel’s living expenses.

      Perhaps Florinda pays for some of the dates too, as it was mentioned that money is not a problem between the pair.

      IMO, Florinda and Joel sound like big spenders who live off their family members. Their relationship seems to be marked by spontaneity, fun, and romance and money is not an issue. Joel’s work is not an issue because he apparently can disappear for months for mysterious reasons from TVB.

      If any of their family members cut off their income streams, how will Joel and Florinda maintain their lavish lifestyle? Will their love survive given a dose of reality and less fun, once money is cut off?

      A relationship built upon fun and a lot of excitement, what will happen when things wind down or responsibility kicks in? Will it last?

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      • Jo replied:

        why can’t u believe that there is really true love in the world putting aside money.

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      • HeTieShou replied:

        @Jo,
        Sadly,money is a needed essential for life and in a relationship/marriage, much more than just “love” is needed in order for it to be lasting and happy.

        I also agree with Jayne that Joel and Florinda’s relationship seems a bit too family dependant and are in the “fun” stage now. I guess it is ok for now since they are not married, however, once you are married, you are expected to support yourself and become more independant. I hope that IF they do want to get married in the future, then they should learn how to be more responsible and independant or else how can they raise or have their own family??

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      • Funn Lim replied:

        I believe his family sees this union as an investment therefore the brother has no problem in footing the bills.

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  3. ita says:

    eh, what’s wrong with his fashion sense. Sorry but he looks like a male escort in that outfit. Now i feel bad making this comment, but he really does.

    34, not high paid job, asking money from family for dating. Started to question his integrity and sense of responsibility.

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    • jayne replied:

      Ita,
      “Started to question his integrity and sense of responsibility. ”

      With easy access to money, then a monetary sense of responsibility will never be learned. If Joel’s TVB acting job only helps him pay for tips at fancy restaurant meals, then he will not understand the drive to work really hard in a job for money to support himself. I equate his current work arrangement to a person volunteering at a nonprofit organization, driven by personal interests. However, that drive to work very hard will not be the same as someone who actually needs the money to support himself.

      Although Raymond Lam comes from a rich family, his family may have instilled a greater sense of responsibility in him by making him pay for his younger brother’s higher education.

      Login or Register before you can reply to jayne
    • Fox replied:

      Ooops, I think he has fashion sense :P.

      From wat I get in the article, he dun say that he has to lean on his family all for the life.

      He was paid HK$10,000 a month (now increased a bit) by TVB, then I dun think he is too poor.

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      • lara replied:

        HK$10,000 per month is not much. He definitely has to rely on his family’s business to survive.

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      • Fox replied:

        HK$10,000 isn’t a big amount but he dun have to pay house rent, only need this to pay for normal life then the amount is ok to live.

        Moreover, he also has a big gym center in Macau to give him more money monthly.

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      • Fox replied:

        And 10k is his basic salary (the thing he stated in the article). He films, he does functions, obvious will give him more money.

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      • Veejay replied:

        @Fox,

        Although his earning may seems decent with films, functions’ etc fees, I’m sure he has ton of bills to pay as well such as credit cards for eg, since his expenditure is so high every month. HKD10 is definitely little for Joel if he’s living a life like millionaire in HK

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      • HeTieShou replied:

        Yea, 10000Hk dollars a month is not much but it is ok for a normal citizen if they didn’t have to pay rent. However, for someone that wants to live the high life, 10000Hk is nothing to them…It all comes down to how you spend that money and whether you want to live the high life or not.

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      • Faith replied:

        HK$10,000 = to US$1,282.00

        That’s little pay

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      • LeilaFan replied:

        Wouldn’t compared HKD to USD, since Joel lives in HK, things he spend and things he buy will all be HKD.
        Example, food here in USD pay in USD would considered more expensive if it was the same food that buy in HK paying in HKD.
        HK$10,000 = to US$1,282.00 —- yes, seem litttle to USA, I can make that amount with working 1 week (but then I have to pay taxes) Haha!!
        But for HK people using HKD living in Hong Kong $10,000HKD is already good pay for normal people.

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      • Funn Lim replied:

        which is why many in hk is living in poverty. Because more than half of that is for rent. Leilafan sometimes I wonder do you know the reality of the world. In us maybe you can survive on that in hk a clerk probably makes that amt. TVb is famous for low salary which is,why cms and endorsement is crucial or for the others a second job

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      • LeilaFan replied:

        I know the reality world, I came from China, and the poverty in China is much more worst than HK. Do you know that many Chinese girls now in China would love to be able to come to HK or USA. There many children in Guizhou, China are hungry, just like children in North Korea.
        And you prefer to married rich and I prefer to married poor, does not make me less realistic than you. That just means I like to get my a-s-s out to work and make money with my own hands.
        I move out of the house at age 18, I rent my own place and pay my own rent. I went to college, graduate and have a college degree, and I’m working. I work with co-workers everyday , seeing new people everyday, meeting new people everyday at work too. That is pretty realistic life right there.
        And making $1,000 USD a week, a month that is $4,000 USD. A year that is $50,000 that is considered middle class here in California, USA.
        I bet some of you here are not even making $50,000 USD a year.
        I am d-a-m-n happy with the salary I make.

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      • HeTieShou replied:

        @LeilaFan,
        You have to realize that life in HK is really really expensive so 10000HK dollars is not exactly enough. You can’t just go comparing to everything in the US. I live in California and we have a very high standard of living here compared to most of the other states, but I don’t want to compare since the standard of living varies depending on where you live. Even within the US, it is not really accurate to compare one state to another, but to compare the US to Hk?? I don’t find that quite accurate….

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      • HeTieShou replied:

        @LeilaFan,
        Sorry but there is no need for you to brag about how much you make….Regardless of how your life is in the US, it is going to be different in HK and other countries in the world. Therefore, there is no need for you to compare to anyone or anywhere…

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      • HeTieShou replied:

        I also wanted to add that you would not be able to live on $1282 a month in California since most of that would go to rent(if you don’t live with others). Even if you did share with others, at least $500-600 of that would go to rent and in some cases that is not even including bills yet. Then you honestly don’t have much left at all…

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      • LeilaFan replied:

        California living standard is far less expensive than New York.
        Give you example OK, I make $1,000 USD a week, a month that is $4,000 USD. A year that is $50,000 that is considered middle class here in California, USA. (Ofcourse there are tax deduction too, we all pay taxes).
        But who would say that making $50,000 USD a year in USA is low income? HeTieShou, even yourself are not making $50,000 USD a year.
        Usually if you making $50,000 USD a year, you at least have a college degree.
        I live far on more than comfortable with my salary, we are not low income people if one person in the household bring home $50,000 USD a year. (But damn the taxes)
        I live in Southern California, how about HeTieShou, you from Southern or Northern?
        And for HK, I’m not Hong Kong so I don’t know. But in China, any people working would like to make $10,000RMB a week.

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      • LeilaFan replied:

        And HeTieShou, please read this, I say “a week” not a month OK.
        HK$10,000 = to US$1,282.00 —- yes, seem litttle to USA, I can make that amount with working 1 week (but then I have to pay taxes) Haha!!
        And I’m sorry but I don’t brag, I always said I am dirt poor and my husband is dirt poor, and we are ugly people and we dirt poor, Hahaha!
        How much money I have, I put in the bank. Anyone ask, I just say “I’m dirt poor”

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      • LeilaFan replied:

        And HeTieShou, excuse me, I come from China, I born in China. I have every rights to compared my salary to China salary.
        And I apoligize, I read it wrong. Joel was pay $10,000 HKD a month. My bad, I thought they said $10,000 HKD a week.

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      • Funn Lim replied:

        let her brag because she is earning what is middle class income and to us by conversion is high paying job. Just because you worked young and way up doesnt mean you are in touch with reality of those earning lesser. Sometimes you get out of touch. Malaysia still has people earning 500 per month. Reality cost of living is lower than here unless you are talking beverly hills. Hk cost of living is high hence the 10000 number but that doesnt get you much not a car at least. Well i think i should ask my sugar daddy for a maserati. Like you said i dream of marrying rich. But then you seem to forget like you i earn my own living and unlike you i do not have a husband to combine income

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      • ita replied:

        After reading all the comment. I am so curious w/ the market salary in HK and decided to do some search. Looks like 10000 HKD is very basic salary, those who don’t have working experience office worker normally got paid starting 7500-9000. This is base from i read, dont’ know for sure since i never live there before.

        I think in US you can survive with 1000 plus salary (been there done that). But not quite sure in hongkong since i read that the rent over there is crazy.

        The comment that i made here is base on what i read from the above article, of course don’t know for sure his financial situation. But he strike me as someone who spend more than he earn. The plane ticket alone equal to 4 months of his base salary.

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      • Fox replied:

        HK$10,000 is the basic salary.

        To go for a function, he can be paid HK$20-30,000.

        To a series, he might get HK$60-70,000 (assume that his supporting roles will appear in 6-7 eps in total for a series, might be more because he often has supporting, not KLF).

        Being spokenperson, he can get HK$100,000++ for his status.

        The gym center can give him HK$100,000++ per month.

        Then in a month, Joel can have at least HK$200,000++.

        Guess it’s ok for life.

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      • Fox replied:

        @ita: According to my friend, 10-20,000 a month is considered as low pay. A student can get 30-40,000 a month or more for his/her first job. Group leader in a company have 60-80,000 a month. The house is expensive, the carpark is expensive. And HK ppl love luxury clothes and stuffs, then a lot of money are paid for them.

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      • ita replied:

        @hetieshou agree w/ you can’t compare even within US. I was at georgia during that time so the living cost is not that high. Lots of my friend move from LA to Texas and bought big houses since in TX is away cheaper than LA.

        @leilafan how can you say yourself dirt poor, from your description it suppose to be middle class income.

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      • LeilaFan replied:

        smile @ita
        No, I’m not dirt poor. Me and my husband both have college degree and working. So we can’t be poor, here in USA if you have a college degree with the right major, you can get decent job and be middle class.
        Life is good for me, I have enough money for monthly bills and spending, I’m not rich but I’m middle class, and I’m happy.
        Considered my life back then in China, I feel very bless, many girls in China right now would love to go to USA and have the life that I am having right now.
        And I read it wrong, I thought it said that Joel get pay $10,000HKD a WEEK, then it be good to live, but I see he get pay $10,000HKD a MONTH, then ofcourse not enough if you have no other sources of income.

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      • Kidd replied:

        All along, I got the impression that Leilafan is poor but happy. But, guess I’m wrong all this time.

        She’s actually pretty well do to.

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      • LeilaFan replied:

        I am middle class, just like other middle class here in USA.
        I was poor when I first come to USA. But then I go to college and get a degree and working, so now I am not poor anymore.
        But certainly I’m not rich.
        And taxes here in USA is pretty high, to single is even higher, married you got tax less.
        Tax in China is less than here in USA.
        And I thank you USA for giving everyone an opportunity to go to school and graduate. My 4 years in University I get Free government grants to paid for my tuition, I get my degree for Free. If I was in China, I would not have all this, so I really appreciate USA.

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      • Chriselle replied:

        Lol, good that you clarified Leilafan. In one of your posts you mentioned being “dirt poor” so many times I was getting a bit scared for you. At least we know you at least have a laptop/computer to go on this blog so your situation can’t be that bad. 😉

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      • Funn Lim replied:

        then leilafan u r even better than me. My education wasnt free and paid by daddy as in my father. Now i can say im a working girl and using phone to post this.no laptop. How then can u b dirt poor and mock us so?! U r mid class and b proud of that. No need to creat impression of dire financial situation to make a point. Anyway ad here; in need of rich sugar daddy here preferably looking, with the namd and is my idol singer. I am cheap to maimtain.

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      • LeilaFan replied:

        LOL! Our house have 3 computers, 1 my husband use, a desktop for me to use and a laptop for me to use if I need to be lay down in bed, and have the laptop next to my pillow, LOL!
        I get Free government Grants in USA because when I was 18, I live by myself renting a place to stay, my working money were to paid rent, so I considered to be low income when I apply for University. I get Financial Aid in University and they paid all my Tuition, so Yah, I got my degree for Free.
        And for Funn, USAyou not married so you always have chances of meet the man of your dream, don’t forget to invite all of us Jaynestars people to your wedding okie, “smile”!
        I envy you, you single and free. I wish I was single again, so I can do the things I want to do, go places I want to go. Now, not much choices to go when my son is too young. Sign!

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      • P replied:

        LeilaFan, u live in rowland heights?

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      • LeilaFan replied:

        @P, why you guess Rowland Heights? You can see my IP? Smile!

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      • LeilaFan replied:

        @P, I live in Rancho Cucamonga, California
        Since I got married me and my husband buy a house in Rancho Cucamonga so we move there, it is nice city. Now we just have to worried our monthly mortgage payment, LOL!
        Before I live in Los Angeles, and I went to college in Los Angeles.
        @P, so what make you guess I live in Rowland Heights? You have relatives lives there P?

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      • Veejay replied:

        @Leilafan,

        Wow you got 3 pcs! Mine just broke down few months ago and I’ve save for the repair cost hehe. I’m currently using my office pc to communicate with yall and while at home, I’ll use Mobile to post but Its really hard to post stuff using mobile! I prefer a laptop!

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      • P replied:

        LeilaFan, it was a guess cuz a lot of chinese people live in alhambra, rowland heights, rosmead,and irvine.

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      • HeTieShou replied:

        @LeilaFan,
        Sorry but I don’t even understand most of what you are saying since it doesn’t even make sense. When did I say that making $50000 US dollars was a low income?? Most of my brothers make around that much. What right do you have to say that I don’t make that much or not?? Also, IF you are not from HK and know nothing about HK then why are you going on and on about HK and comparing it to CHina, the US or anywhere??? I live in Northern California and our standard of living here is really high, but probably not as high as New York. The point is even in the US, the standard of living varies from state to state so what is the point of comparing???

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      • HeTieShou replied:

        @LeilaFan,
        I don’t know how you are in real life, but you seem to brag a bit here. Sorry, but I don’t think you need to say that I make less then $50000 or not ok?YOu make it seem like you are so great and superior to me and others. Also, your degree does NOT always dictate how much money you make. I have seen people with no degrees make more than $50000 per year. If you want to say degree, then I have a masters but don’t make as much as someone with a bachelors since my profession doesn’t pay much. However, I don’t think that money is everything…

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      • LeilaFan replied:

        @HeTieShuo. You right, money is not everything, this I state many times in most of my post.
        And to answer your question, I can compared HK to USA or China if I want. Why? Because this is the posting board, I can write my comparision up here as long as I don’t use bad languages.
        And don’t get uncomfortable over someone writing on the internet, in life there are things not going to go your way, what you doing to do? Go rip your head off just because someone say something against your little ego.
        And I have Bachelor degree, and here in USA anyone graduate college salary are at least $40,000 to $50,000 if you are in the right major and good connection. The right major and good connection will landed you a job, just with a Bachelor degree.

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      • HeTieShou replied:

        @LeilaFan,
        Sorry but YOU are the one with the BIG ego so I don’t understand why you are saying that I have one… Geez… You need a reality check…Anyway, but since you are so into yourself there is not much more for me or anyone to say. Also, you hardly even know me and here you are saying that I don’t even make $50000 a year so who’s the one with an ego???Many in my family make more than $50000 a year but so what?? You make it seem like you are so great and well off and put me and others down like we are nothing. I actually don’t care what people say online like I used to in the past, but now I realize what is the point?? I don’t even care for those people that think that they are so great in real life, so why should I care about what others say on the net?? It seems like you do though..

        I am glad that we at least agree that money is not everything. One of my cousin’s makes a lot as well, but guess what she does?? She works at a gambling casino… It’s not just how much you make, but what do you do to make that much??

        It is true that you can compare to wherever you want, but whether it is accurate or not is a different story. I know you are from China, but how long has it been since you have been there?? Plus, you no longer live there so whatever comparison you make may or may not be valid. But whatever, say what you like because most of it doesn’t even make sense…

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      • LeilaFan replied:

        I don’t even care for those people that think that they are so great in real life, so why should I care about what others say on the net?? ————
        Obviously you care what people said on the net, since you are replies to my saying on the net text chat right now.
        Because I have you and others who are willing to feed me and replies to me so I have every reason to replies back.

        A person truely don’t care will just state their viewpoints and move on. Not keep coming back and replies and feeding them with more arguments for them to replies back.

        And I have every rights to compared any countries that I want, and I will continue to do so. And there nothing you acn stop me.

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    • sure-lee replied:

      Hey guys,

      I’m just wondering, since you guys are all familiar names appearing on this blog, around what age span are you guys? LOL

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      • LeilaFan replied:

        I am 27 year olds

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      • Veejay replied:

        I was born in 1980 a year younger than Tavia, Ron, Ray etc 😀

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  4. Ah K says:

    Hi Jayne,

    I think it should be Joel and not Joe in some parts of the interview, yes yes? Anyway, thank you for editing this so quickly! And I see that you have translated the article on Viann Zhang haha, good good! I almost translated it lol! Haha fortunately I saved it for the last! 😛

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    • jayne replied:

      Ah K,
      I fixed the errors. I have a subconscious tendency to type more common derivatives of names such as Joe rather than Joel.

      Viann and Ron’s news are too hot! Must put it up quickly! Btw, I started work on Kate/ Bosco article just in case our tastes are the same.

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      • ita replied:

        ah K and Jayne, thanks for translating the news so fast. It’s always nice to have something to read at night. =)

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      • Ah K replied:

        Oops haha oh no, I’m translating the Bosco and Kate interview too lol! How how? Which part are you at now? 😀

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      • edmwer replied:

        Lol! You two are so cute! :p

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      • Ah K replied:

        @ita:

        You are welcome. Always comforting to know that people appreciates our humble translation work! 😀

        @edmwer:

        LOL! 😀

        @Jayne:

        I think I shall abandon ship and leave it for you the professional to translate it lol. Decided not to translate it anymore lest you end up doing double work of editing. Shall translate other articles instead! But I look forward to the translated piece of Bosco and Kate’s interview haha they sound hilarious! 😀

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  5. Summer says:

    “My brother’s company in Macau would give me some money too.”

    I was also thinking the same thing that he is using his brother’s money to sustain his living habits. Even if he might has a share in his brother’s/family’s company but it doesn’t seem like he contributes anything to deserve it. So it sounds like he is asking his parents or his elder brother for allowance. (I don’t know that’s what I think)

    One thing I find him suspicious is …

    “R: “When did you first started courting Florinda?”
    Joel laughed happily, “What?! Can I not say this? Well, it wasn’t deliberately.”

    Does the timeline have to do with his divorce; did he cold-heartedly divorce his wife for Florinda? But Florinda said they dated for four months. Does anyone know when he divorces his wife? Am I just thinking too much into this?

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    • lara replied:

      I think they dated MORE than 4 months. Didn’t she get flowers on V-day back in Feb and also her bday is in Feb? Yeh I weckon he started to pursue her whilst he was still married.

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      • Fox replied:

        You dun count the pursuit time? 4 months might the the period they are truly together, but they can start way before that.

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    • Fox replied:

      He said he divorced 3 years ago.

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      • Summer replied:

        Really? He divorced 3 years ago, then why did the reporters said something else.
        I guess, I didn‘t really know that.

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      • Fox replied:

        Keyword: He said.

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      • ita replied:

        From what i read, he said he was married 3 years ago but never really mentioned when he got divorce.

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      • Faith replied:

        There were pictures of him and his wife together last yr.

        he dumped his wife for Florinda and her money

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    • Ah K replied:

      @Summer:

      “Does the timeline have to do with his divorce; did he cold-heartedly divorce his wife for Florinda? But Florinda said they dated for four months. Does anyone know when he divorces his wife? Am I just thinking too much into this?”

      Nope, I don’t think you were thinking too much cause I share the same thoughts as you and Joel Chan’s ex wife posted something on Weibo like “He isn’t a good man. If he was such a good man why do you think he hasn’t been snatched yet?” – that ‘He’ seems to be referring to Joel, will translate the article if time forbids.

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      • Summer replied:

        Well since they announced they are dating. I bet we will hear more from the ex-wife and then we can hear her side of the story. I mean Florinda is young and rich and probably stupid in love with Joel if he is really not a good man. But we will see.

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  6. Lucia says:

    Summer and Ah K,

    I also have a similar thought like you guys that perhaps, Joel was chasing Florinda while he was still with his ex-wife.

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  7. Kidd says:

    “Earlier, there were reports that you owed the travel agency about $40,000 HKD for the plane tickets and even went back on your initial promise of paying straightaway after receiving the tickets?”

    Wow. Plane tickets need up to HKD40,000? It that really that expensive to travel in HK?

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    • Fox replied:

      He uses first class, of course expensive :P.

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    • josie replied:

      Multiple trips to UK and back in first class- 40K isn’t too much.

      I guess he wasn’t able to pay his bills b/c he wasn’t working during this hiatus. that story about giving money to a friend to pay sounds like the “my dog ate my homework” excuse. couldn’t he have charged it to a credit card?

      BTW, didn’t filming of “my cruel lover” already wrap? Is Tim sir giving him another chance on a new upcoming series?

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      • Fox replied:

        Yes, another series with Lee Tim Shing.

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      • Fox replied:

        “my dog ate my homework” excuse – haha I rmb I watched a cartoon where a kid used “dog ate my homework” as an excuse for the whole year, then when he finished all of his homework in the last day, ironically, dog really ate his homework.

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      • Ah K replied:

        @josie @Fox:

        In a previous interview with Florinda, they asked her whether the work she said Joel will be starting on, was it Lee-Tim Sing’s new drama and she said yes. I think it should be his new drama project, “天梯 “, starring Moses Chan, Maggie Cheung Ho Yee and Joel Chan and not “My Cruel Lover”.

        Sorry that I failed to realize this earlier on when I was translating, I didn’t know Tim-Gor had a new drama series for Joel to star in, besides “My Cruel Lover” My sincere apologies once again, @Jayne, hope you could make the necessary amendments please, thank you and sorry for the trouble! 😀

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      • josie replied:

        Ah K, why do u need to apologize? It’s not your fault that we compulsively nit-pick. 🙂

        Thank you and Jayne for all your hard work!

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      • Ah K replied:

        @josie:

        Welcome! That’s sweet of you but it’s really my fault lahs, I should have checked properly instead of jumping to conclusions that the new Tim-Gor’s drama Joel and Florinda were referring to was “My Cruel Lover” Haha but never mind, it’s ok, I learned something new today! 😀

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      • Minami replied:

        Fox, that sounds like a hilarious cartoon! hahaha, I have dogs too but none of them have ever eaten any homework 😀

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  8. vivien says:

    Hmmmm read that Joel doesn’t earn much as a tvb artist. i wonder how much does a tvb artist earn?

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  9. Funn Lim says:

    How is this news? One is never has been, one is who cares…

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    • Minami replied:

      Well, I guess if you’re not interested to read about Joel Chan, you don’t have to click here 🙂

      I for one appreciate the translators’ hard work, it’s definitely a bit of work to translate articles..I think there is something for everyone here, everyone has their own preferences for what is called ‘news’…just another case of one man’s meat is another man’s poison.

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      • Funn Lim replied:

        Not liking a news does not mean I do not appreciate the translator’s hard work. I am asking if this news? Is he news? In fact is he news worthy?

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      • Ah K replied:

        @Minami:

        I’m sure @Jayne will be very pleased to hear of your appreciations! 😀

        @Funn Lim didn’t meant it that way lahs, she might come off as being a little too frank and brash sometimes but I think she does appreciate every translator’s piece of work at Jaynestars, if not she wouldn’t have been coming back to read them and even be the long-time commentator of this site. And if you hang around long enough, you will know that she generally means no harm lahs, in this case, I think she was just concerned why the reporters had to put this piece of news as headline news when Joel is just some B or C-lister in TVB.

        I do wholeheartedly agree with you though that different people have varying tastes as to which news they feel is “newsworthy”. Just like you, I felt curious about Joel and Florinda’s relationship to want to probe more about it but others may not think so. As one of the many and newest translators here, I think I can safely say that it is hard to gauge what Jaynestars readers hope to read about and are interested in. Furthermore, as translators, we are not God, we cannot control what the press choose to or not choose to report as our main task is just to translate. Thus as you said, if the readers are not interested in this piece of news then just don’t click it and read the other entertainment news on site instead. Lastly, thank you, it is indeed heartwarming to know when people appreciate a translator’s work, makes (at least) me feel that time taken to translate it was all worth it 🙂

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      • HeTieShou replied:

        I know it is hard work to translate since I used to do it too. I did chapters in books and they were soooo long… Therefore, I know firsthand how it is…

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    • Minami replied:

      @ Funn, Ok, I guess some people still find this piece of news interesting, me included.

      @ Ah K, you’re welcome! I do know how hard it is to translate and totally appreciate your efforts haha…btw, although Joel was/ is not very famous, I always thought he was quite good looking haha so maybe that explains my fascination with this piece of news and I guess everyone likes a ‘scandal’ now and then.

      Yeah for instance, I cannot stand Kate Tsui so I just skip when the title of the article is about her

      But good job! It’s so nice to destress here when the ‘real’ world gets too pressured 😀

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  10. pandamao says:

    who’s that pretty girl on the right above the wife???

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    • Kidd replied:

      Most probably Laurinda Ho.

      http://www.snaapa.com/Amber/LaurindaHo003

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      • Chriselle replied:

        Yep, she is. 🙂 I think the media has said that she is the prettiest of Stanley Ho’s daughters, which I agree although I haven’t seen some of his older daughters.

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    • Fox replied:

      Florinda’s sister Laurinda.

      Laurinda is now having rumour with Pakho – the one who said that lost to Joel in the race to get Florinda.

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      • Chriselle replied:

        “Laurinda is now having rumour with Pakho – the one who said that lost to Joel in the race to get Florinda.”

        LMAO! 😛 I hope he doesn’t get her though. Is Pakho a singer or model? Why is he always rumored with the pretty and rich ladies?

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      • Fox replied:

        Pakho is a singer. A potential singer. I like his singing and maybe his style, too. I prefer him than Jason Chan who came out in the same year as him (2007). A lot of ppl commented that Jason has good voice but maybe the impression of me to Jason isn’t good from the first time I heard him live. This day, Jason has the worst live in 2007 peers.

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  11. Veejay says:

    Don’t have good impression on this guy Joel who spending on his bro’s monies just to date heiress like florinda.

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    • HeTieShou replied:

      His older brother must really love him to allow him to do that. However, if he continues like that, I am not sure if his brother and parents would put up with it. Therefore, I really question if their relationship will last.

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      • Funn Lim replied:

        It is part love and part investment. She is of higher pedigree richer good for status and business ties. A matter of practicality and certainly acertain sum must be spent to woo her. Who wouldnt want to be in laws with the richest man in macau? If lee kashing has a daughter it would be the same.

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      • Veejay replied:

        @HTS,

        Maybe like Funn mentioned they must be hoping high thinking his bro will marry florinda one day to increase any sort of their income.

        I dont see good in this relationship, florinda is too high maintenance for any “rich” guy to maintain. Her life is rich with luxury accomodations and I think Joel’s brother money can keep sponsoring Joel for another few years.

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      • Veejay replied:

        *Joel’s bro money can’t keep sponsoring his bro for another few years.

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  12. Faith says:

    TVB finally gives him some meaty roles then he does a disappearance act.
    He dumped his wife for her money

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  13. sehseh says:

    Jayne, do keep this form handy in your site.

    http://tinyurl.com/2af8ud5

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    • jayne replied:

      Sehseh,
      That was a good one! LOL, hopefully no one is suffering from butthurt. Let’s all be mature, logical beings and deal with diversity in the proper way.

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  14. Kidd says:

    When Joel and Florinda speak about their relationship, it got me wonder.

    Joel and Florinda got together because they both love fashion and currently, they both are enjoying a life of fun. This reminds me very much of Joel and his ex-wife who also both love fashion, willing to buy really expensive clothes. Report also said Joel uses more than his income.

    I wonder if the relationship broke down because Joel’s ex-wife has outgrown him. Maybe his ex-wife want to settle down, plan for the future etc and Joel still want to maintain his usual lifestyle. Thus, they grew apart.

    Just a thought.

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  15. Kim Kim says:

    hopeless fellas!! not looking to marry into tycoon family, then for what??

    loves his ex-wife’s posting on weibo:

    The greatest revenge to a girl that steals your man is to let her have him, because a truly good man can never be stolen —— 对一个抢自己男朋友的女孩子最大的报复是让她拥有他,因为真正的好男人是永远都不会被人抢走的。

    This is so so true…..a magnanimous woman!!

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  16. Minami says:

    Wow, I was searching for news on Joel Chan and saw this old thread..I tried my best to read the ‘debate’ between Leilafan and the rest and seriously, trying to read it gave me a headache!

    I’m amazed that you guys (Funn, Jayne, Kidd) were patient enough to try replying to her.

    @Leilafan, I guess I’m asking for your capital letters but seriously your written English is really hard to understand and you mix words up a lot – the gals were really kind to reply to you and explain to you so nicely. Since you like examples, it is ‘it takes two to tango” not two to ‘tangle’ like you said and countless others that I can’t bear to recollect.

    You kept talking about your 50K a year salary, to be honest that’s not that much in California. I have lived in Southern CA before and my salary was way above 50K, with all the taxes etc – I found that mine was not that much well at least not enough to brag about.

    I’m seriously quite curious as to what you do for a living/ what kind of degree you have as your command of English is quite frankly of quite a low level (sorry!) – most successful people don’t go around telling people how ‘successful’ they are because simply, they don’t have to.

    haha very amusing indeed!

    Just for the record, I disagree with your blanket statement.

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